Simcountry
Forum Little Upsilon The Case for the NULO (Golden Rainbow)

The Case for the NULO (Golden Rainbow)

O
Okstate Guy (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 04:24 Link
I'm totally lost King?

Are you seeing things again? Hearing voices maybe?


Now lets run along and update those Web sites like you promised.


:) mmKay?
K
King Hezekiah (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 04:37 Link
I opened up the NLUO Structure Page, There are your answers..
Z
Zentrino (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 15:21 Link
King, I hope you would agree that I have tried to be a neutral observer in this thread. I have asked genuine questions about your proposal because, quite honestly, it intrigued me. I am not a "war player" or a "terrorist." I just thought the idea of a world body might help sort out the many, many wars that get fought on our planet. Here is what I have found:
1. The body you propose seems to have structural inadequacies that would render its decision ineffective were there to be any true threat to peace.
2. The entire model could easily be infiltrated by those who wish to destroy the system or change the system.
3. The website lists a different governmental model than the one proposed here. Namely, the chairman of the Elite party has the power to make the final decisions. It also states that the capital country remains the same and "rotates" the president. This seems infeasible to me and again poses a serious security risk for the organization. This info is found here:

http://newlittleupsilonorder.webs.com/capitalcitycountry.htm

4. The World Governing Body should not be a religious organization. We should strive in RL and in game life to allow religious freedom. In no way should this game dictate to anyone what religions they should learn about. Throughout this entire thread, you have never said this was a religious-based organization. This info is found here:

http://newlittleupsilonorder.webs.com/godofnluo.htm

There are also links regarding dietary law and keeping the Sabbath. I am not sure how anyone knows if that is followed in RL for members or not, but it certainly has no part in a game.

5. The "Laws" listed are the 10 Commandments of the KJ Bible. I don't believe these would be sufficient for governing a world body, especially a government that is make believe and in a game.

There seems to be a lot of religious mingling with the governmental mechanism on the site. If you truly want a world body that can help keep peace on LU, I suggest you begin by creating a secular government free from religious entanglements.

I have been as open-minded as possible about this. I have never had any conflicts with you and still do not. I continue to be intrigued by the idea of a world body that could represent the interests of the larger community on LU.
However, I find this proposal seriously flawed both in governmental mechanics and in religious affiliation.
I will not be able to join your organization or support its implementation. I hope you do not think this makes me a terrorist. Should necessary changes be made, I would be willing to revisit the idea. I am certain you will tell me I can change things by joining the organization. But, people don't join groups they disagree with just to change them--you join because you agree with their ideas in the first place.
Thank you for your time and consideration.
Zen.
K
King Hezekiah (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 15:40 Link
I respect what you said because you did not direct your coments on me personally. I understand your concern about religion, but there is not religion there, It is just the Bible. Religion comes with tradition, the Bible is not tradition. I won't be able to take down the Bible because it is the truth. Whether anyone wants to admitt it.. People try to interpret the Bible, and that is why you have all these religions. We do not research as a people, humans. I put the information there because it is researched. If you take the time out to learn something you will know it. Everyone has a preconceived emotion of what they think is truth, therefore overlooking what the truth is, and calling the truth, what we think it is... We look at free will like it means we can do what we want to do, when in actuality free will is the ability to make a choice. There are only 2 choices in life. Live or die...
O
Okstate Guy (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 18:07 Link
Semantics:

the meaning or relationship of meanings of a sign or set of signs ; especially : connotative meaning b: the language used (as in advertising or political propaganda) to achieve a desired effect on an audience especially through the use of words with novel or dual meanings

Merriam-Webster Dictionary :)
K
King Hezekiah
16 Jan 2009 21:13 Link
Again, follow the world or the Bible..
K
King Hezekiah
16 Jan 2009 21:15 Link
It is your choice. It is funy how people try to make what I say not as impacting by their shrewd comments to make me look bad, but you works are vain...
O
Okstate Guy (Little Upsilon)
16 Jan 2009 21:29 Link
:)
K
King Hezekiah
16 Jan 2009 21:36 Link
How?
K
King Hezekiah
16 Jan 2009 21:45 Link
I can put down all the Christian traditions with the Bible. That is all I am saying. Truth trumps Tradition, if the Bible is considered the truth in your eyes. If the Bible is not the truth, and a history book in your eyes, disreguard what I say.. I don't want to offend anyone....
K
King Hezekiah
16 Jan 2009 21:47 Link
Here they go again. Deleting posts...

Please let me know why you are doing that? Please!!
Z
Zentrino
16 Jan 2009 22:15 Link
Anyone else think this thread jumped the shark at about post 58?
:)
G
Grayson301 (Little Upsilon)
17 Jan 2009 01:31 Link
A CASE FOR THE NLUO.
prehaps the Nluo shouldn't be a world government but a Federation of nation states.Each Nation State holding a seat in the Nluo Federation partys Chambers.these chamber seats could then be elected to the Elite( or upper chamber) to HELP make the rules that the Federation was run by. Each lower chamber would discuss a rule or decision and pass it up to the next chamber for consideration then when it was ratified by the other chambers it would become Rule of the Federation with the top chamber acting out enforcment on the Federation members it had.
Now then the Chairman and Presidentual seats would be open for election on a regular bases while the other seats wouldn't change so often.
A Nluo Federation could be modeled after parlament and/or the house of representatives and congress .. with the power of the people within the FEDERATION governing it
it's just an idea and
then King could have his NLUO and People could see it in action.
But before at can be a world body it must first be a FEDERATION
I
iwin (Little Upsilon)
17 Jan 2009 16:42 Link
Dear NLUO spokes-persons,

I do not want to be involved. Thank you for your time.

iwin
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Little Upsilon)
17 Jan 2009 17:30 Link
"Dear NLUO spokes-persons,

I do not want to be involved. Thank you for your time."

iwin

Now that is one of the most mature repsonses to proly any post in the forum to date.

Hats off to iwin. Thx again :)
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Golden Rainbow)
17 Jan 2009 19:37 Link
Since post 58 this thread went wrong, so ok, here is its true intent. Thx again for your time.

Hello.

This a topic intended to inform sim citizens of a few misconceptions of NULO and the injustices that are employed in undermining sincere efforts to get this movement off the ground.


At first. I really didn't care much for the Idea. In time I had come to realize that in fact it was a great IDEA at the very least. Many Vets would say that this is terrible. It is meant for King to rule the world with its devices. Its evil incarnate and so on.

Actually this is nowhere near having any truth in it. Those kind of statements are the Vet establishments attempts to remain in a shadow ruling coalition that dominates the SC landscape.They wish t retain power and keep it in place so that no one will be able to change what is already in place.

Under normal circumstances, I would say that what is in place does in fact work. But it is much more complicated than that. There are way too many double standards that apply. For instance, a vet, in his military hat, would boldly do something that is taboo for a new player to do. Yet the establishment will hold new players accountable and appease the veteran. There have been instances where where the double standard is exposed and then the vet, counting on relationships with other vets, will fabricate justification for such blatantly wrong action.

Do not confuse what I am saying. I have had good and bad experiences with new and vet alike. Most Vets are very helpful, willing, and able to be very humble and key to new player development. But Heaven forbid a player cross paths with a player who is a vet, and exchange insult for insult on the forum. Or simply not immediately bow in obesiance to a veterans threats of unjustified action, when things could be averted through other means. When this happens, a more powerful player will almost always dominate the new player, which is exactly why this kind of action is not even necessary to avoid adverse consequences to either party.

The NLUO if implemented, would consist of 144 members. Individuals, not empires, but presidents that would reflect a larger portion of LU. And accurately reflect the community as a whole. Implementing policy to better avert large scale wars which have been waged. And not continue such wars without being held in lieu of the community having a working in any process regardless if it be peace and/or war.

Many will come out against this IDEA and say adverse things about it, based purely on negative bias, or selfish motives. The reason in my eyes that an elite group of vets disagree with this based purely on unjustified hunger and appetite for power, is that a coalition of nations would threaten to overrule the few powerful voices and have an opposition of majority decision that could one day drown out powerful in favor of the many. This kind of decision making need be made especially in times of conflict to stop wars that only a few wish to perpetuate while the community grows tired. I am saying this without prejudice, because ATM I indeed without going into rhyme or reason am one of the ones that wishes to continue in blood wars, so I am indeed showing how this kind of organization of parties would even sometimes disagree with myself, and hold me even accountable. Not just those who are at odds with me.

If and when it is completed as an organization it would stand to give every one on LU voice to be heard, and give weight to the voice of community. Not just the powerful few.

There are many vets, but true power, rests on a very elite group of a few of them, and they are indeed active in executing the issues of retaining such power. We all know absolute power IS corrupt. And to resist the checking of corruption is to show true intentions of the corrupt forces. They indeed reveal themselves as the ones in power, willing and able to be corrupt.

NLUO looks forward to listening to the concerns of any interested members of LU. Please refrain from basing rebuttals based purely on personal issues and petty arguments that will ruin this discussion. I thank the level heads in advance. Any is welcomed to comment even Q :)

Sincerely

Wendy
(E)Party Chairwoman of the Little Upsilon Institute Political Think Tank
ChairWoman of The SOL Federation
The High Profitess Eternal of The Philadelphian Empire

Proud Elite Party Member of THE ONE and ONLY NLUO
Q
quaxocal (Golden Rainbow)
18 Jan 2009 03:21 Link
King, there are MANY people who do NOT consider the Bible as "the truth", as you do. I am one of those. Other religions are NOT founded from the bible as you so state.

The Jewish religion uses the Old Testament only. The Christian religion combines the Old Testament and the New Testament. The Muslium religion combines the Old Testament and the Koran.

Other major religions have nothing to do with the Bible, such as Buddhism or the Hindu religion. There are MANY others I could list as well.

Just because you feel the Bible to be the truth, does not mean everyone else shares your views. The book itself is full of contradictions and tall-tales and other absurd things. Yes, there are some things you can learn from reading it, but most of it is what I have already stated. This is just MY opinion though. However, there is very little scientific proof or fact resulting from the Bible. Until such time there is more, count me as a non-believer.

However, I respect everyone's beliefs, whatever they may be. You should do the same and not force Christianity on anyone who wishes to join NLUO.

Q
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Golden Rainbow)
18 Jan 2009 04:07 Link
Q Q Q please. Comon We just redirected this topic. Lets not make it into another. Please.
Q
quaxocal (Golden Rainbow)
18 Jan 2009 04:46 Link
I was responding to a legitimate concern of mine, as well as several others. It is a legitimate topic of the NLUO, for anyone who does wish to become a member. As the overtones are clearly visible all over the websites.

It also is a direct reply to several other posts in this thread.

Q
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Little Upsilon)
18 Jan 2009 04:51 Link
Q, I said please, I can say it in other ways,I am trying to play nice.


Play nice!
W
WildEyes (Little Upsilon)
18 Jan 2009 04:55 Link
What we seem to have here is a confusion over the meaning of the word "truth," as opposed to the meaning of the word "factual."


Discuss!
Q
quaxocal (Golden Rainbow)
18 Jan 2009 04:55 Link
How am I not being nice? I'm not saying "remove all religious items from the website". I'm just stating, that some people may have a problem joining an organization that is based somewhat on religion (in this case, Christianity).

He is free to set up the NLUO however he desires. You said even I could comment, so I am. I'm expressing my opinion.

Q
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Little Upsilon)
18 Jan 2009 05:04 Link
Q that part of the convo is done, are we really gonna have to make WP a must. . . again. I said please. I'm not gonna have a childish back and forth with you. Focus on the true meaning of the thread or get ready.

Play Nice!!
S
ShcyzMattiCa (Little Upsilon)
18 Jan 2009 05:06 Link
Since post 58 this thread went wrong, so ok, here is its true intent. Thx again for your time.

Hello.

This a topic intended to inform sim citizens of a few misconceptions of NULO and the injustices that are employed in undermining sincere efforts to get this movement off the ground.


At first. I really didn't care much for the Idea. In time I had come to realize that in fact it was a great IDEA at the very least. Many Vets would say that this is terrible. It is meant for King to rule the world with its devices. Its evil incarnate and so on.

Actually this is nowhere near having any truth in it. Those kind of statements are the Vet establishments attempts to remain in a shadow ruling coalition that dominates the SC landscape.They wish t retain power and keep it in place so that no one will be able to change what is already in place.

Under normal circumstances, I would say that what is in place does in fact work. But it is much more complicated than that. There are way too many double standards that apply. For instance, a vet, in his military hat, would boldly do something that is taboo for a new player to do. Yet the establishment will hold new players accountable and appease the veteran. There have been instances where where the double standard is exposed and then the vet, counting on relationships with other vets, will fabricate justification for such blatantly wrong action.

Do not confuse what I am saying. I have had good and bad experiences with new and vet alike. Most Vets are very helpful, willing, and able to be very humble and key to new player development. But Heaven forbid a player cross paths with a player who is a vet, and exchange insult for insult on the forum. Or simply not immediately bow in obesiance to a veterans threats of unjustified action, when things could be averted through other means. When this happens, a more powerful player will almost always dominate the new player, which is exactly why this kind of action is not even necessary to avoid adverse consequences to either party.

The NLUO if implemented, would consist of 144 members. Individuals, not empires, but presidents that would reflect a larger portion of LU. And accurately reflect the community as a whole. Implementing policy to better avert large scale wars which have been waged. And not continue such wars without being held in lieu of the community having a working in any process regardless if it be peace and/or war.

Many will come out against this IDEA and say adverse things about it, based purely on negative bias, or selfish motives. The reason in my eyes that an elite group of vets disagree with this based purely on unjustified hunger and appetite for power, is that a coalition of nations would threaten to overrule the few powerful voices and have an opposition of majority decision that could one day drown out powerful in favor of the many. This kind of decision making need be made especially in times of conflict to stop wars that only a few wish to perpetuate while the community grows tired. I am saying this without prejudice, because ATM I indeed without going into rhyme or reason am one of the ones that wishes to continue in blood wars, so I am indeed showing how this kind of organization of parties would even sometimes disagree with myself, and hold me even accountable. Not just those who are at odds with me.

If and when it is completed as an organization it would stand to give every one on LU voice to be heard, and give weight to the voice of community. Not just the powerful few.

There are many vets, but true power, rests on a very elite group of a few of them, and they are indeed active in executing the issues of retaining such power. We all know absolute power IS corrupt. And to resist the checking of corruption is to show true intentions of the corrupt forces. They indeed reveal themselves as the ones in power, willing and able to be corrupt.

NLUO looks forward to listening to the concerns of any interested members of LU. Please refrain from basing rebuttals based purely on personal issues and petty arguments that will ruin this discussion. I thank the level heads in advance. Any is welcomed to comment even Q :)

Sincerely

Wendy
(E)Party Chairwoman of the Little Upsilon Institute Political Think Tank
ChairWoman of The SOL Federation
The High Profitess Eternal of The Philadelphian Empire

Proud Elite Party Member of THE ONE and ONLY NLUO
Z
Zentrino (Little Upsilon)
18 Jan 2009 05:27 Link
I still find the idea intriguing. We can ignore the religious concerns for now.

Focusing on Grayson's post above, couldn't the NLUO be a Federation of Federations, sort of an organization representing all of the federations on the planet? The larger feds could have a couple of members each and the smaller feds could have one member each. Each fed could determine its own method for choosing its representative in the NLUO. Maybe some could be elected at large from the community as a whole.
Or, maybe even better, one chamber could be elected as a whole community and one could be made of members elected by the member Feds?
This might make the body more palatable to the larger community while also giving it more ability to wield influence over all of LU.