Gun law

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On top of that, families with guns are just canon meat for a professional army. So, maclean, your first argument does not work.<!-/Quote-!>

Up until the point they themselves, begin to organize.

How many world governments today exist simply because the people got fed up, organized, and threw out the "professional army" of an oppressive government?

Possible but not real likely.

I could however, see armed citizens allowing a country to survive more or less intact should a total economic collapse happen.

How much use are the police and military going to be in a situation like that. None what so ever, no country in history has ever has had a standing army large enough, or strong enough to hold it's self together if the entire population went "ape shit".

Whatever the situation the reasons are still the same. Are you willing to rely on someone else to protect you?

Personally I'm not, nor have I ever been, that is a issue entirely separate from anything else no matter how you wish to twist it.

When do you think the economy is going to collapse?

I'll just drop this here and carry on my merry little way: http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/07/29/602491/scalia-rocket-launcher/

Yankee,

I'm not sure what you are saying in the above post.

Is it you could the see people overthrowing the professional army of an oppressive government.

However, that if there were an economic collapse the people might allow the country to survive intact, more or less.

But to answer your question, Yes, I'm willing to rely on someone else to protect me.

However, I also support the right to bear arms and personally have them in my home.

Lod Lee i dont recall mentioning you in my post at all, nevertheless rather or not if your a he or she. if your reffering to "Yea Crafty i'd say she missed the smoking gun" I was reffering to the physco therapist who the shooter was under in Colordado. And YES, having guns of your own can persuade a country not to invade. NO it doesnt stand a chance agaisnt a proffesional army. My point is the story of the woman who defended herslef and her child agaisnt two men breaking into her house. Thats why citizens need guns. And also to protec tthemselves agaisnt goverment. I mean it may not be much but it'll put a hole in someone and thats all that matters now isnt it? Im not willing to rely on someone else to protect me. If china invaded the US, the war would probally last decades with two super powers of this caliber. Provided Nukes arent involved. And with that going on, theres gonna be looters and every thing u can think of in between murderers and rapist. If im living in the woods somewhere away from cities to try and survive as long as possible, i would want a rifle to help keep enimies at bay. Of course this is not likely to happen as i'd probally be the first to go. Bottom line, people fear anyone with a gun. Man or WOman. Like i said...its the great equalizer. I think the world would be better off without guns period, milatary and all. So when everyone else lays down, i'll lay down. Until then im taking care of my own.

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When do you think the economy is going to collapse?<!-/Quote-!>

In the United States?

When the U.S. dollar is no longer accepted as an international trade currency.

Could be, not in my lifetime, could be Next week. I would predict most definitely however, within my children's lifetime.

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Yankee,

I'm not sure what you are saying in the above post.

Is it you could the see people overthrowing the professional army of an oppressive government.<!-/Quote-!>

It's happened all over the world including here in what we now call the United States.

Do I think everyone in the U.S. needs their firearms so they can overthrow the government? No I do not. If the population as a whole would simply vote, then that's all that's needed for any change as far as Government is concerned. It takes time and determination, but the people here do have a say.

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However, that if there were an economic collapse the people might allow the country to survive intact, more or less.<!-/Quote-!>

What if the economy of the U.S. was destroyed? It's the people who've suddenly lost all their "toys" that would concern me rather than anything the U.S. Government would or could do.

Most of the initial damage would be from people rioting for what they wanted rather than what was necessary to survive, and that's before anything got really serious overall.

The simple fact is no government can provide everyone with everything they want.

When it was all said and done would I want something other than the type of Constitutional form of Government we already have? No I would not, so if enough like me survive, so would our form of Government.

I pay my taxes to support both the Police, Military, along with a multitude of additional agenda for this country. That doesn't mean I feel they can be relied on 24-7 to keep me or anyone else safe.

lord lee I find you to be extremely myopic and distasteful in your posts

Gunther I am not narrow minded! I happen to be very socially liberal and open minded. I believe drugs should be legalized for instance and taxed, gay marriage, women priests etc.

it can go both ways lord lee

Is anyone else curious how this happened at the time the UN Arms Treay concerning gun control is taking place, on July 27th. An unarmed America is defintly something a certain group of people would want. Look at James Holmes in court, he doesnt even look like he know what he did. And there was a video released last month by Lil Wayne, called My Homies Still. AND GUESS WHAT, there sitting in a theature with 12 SKELOTONS. And in the previews of the batman movie, there was a preview where gangsters were shooting up a movie theature. The mainstream media isnt talking much about where this unemployed 24 year old got the money to afford all these expensive things he had to pull this off. And the shooting takes place at a movie called the Dark knight Rises, im no atheist people. And theres someone else called The Dark Knight. In the UK, theres a commercial for a truck called COLOADO, and in that commercial theres a destroyed stadium. In the movie the Dark knight, theres also ma stadium blown up, is this a look at things to come in the UK London games? Im not conspiracy nut job but i have an open mind. And it seems with this happening, its got people even on Simcountry saying the goverment should take away our guns, be easier for them to control an unarmed population. Theres even hundreds of more "Things" i can point out. But do your own research with what the connection is between Auorro and a Dark Knight is. If your not religious, even you cant deny somethings. I mean do you really think the world is what it seems all the time?

creepy VOTE RON PAUL

Ron Paul's otu for the cat. And by the people...the Lil Wayne video was released 3 DAYS beofre this shooting took place. Watch it for yourself its called ( My hoMIES Still). Theres peoples heads on the walls like dear heads as if they were hunted and killed just like they were in the shooting. Theres a woman dressed as a bat in a cage, theres 12, COUNT THEM, 12 SKELOTONS in a THETURE, and then the rappers cover their ears as if they hear gun shots. The Dark knight has risen, but it aint no freaking batman. Last year a movie called The Immortals portrayed falling angels descending to earth. Now we see the Dark KnIGHT rising. Even if these Hollywood people are just doing htis as their own crazy stunts...it seems to be tying over to real life. Dont worry about voting. it will do nothing. Just dont let this shooting force you to beleive our guns should be taken. Remember in 1975 when Jaws was released....the beaches were empty, you can best believe the elite were paying attention to this kind of terror. Now they use it as a way to scare the public into doing what they want.

forgive my spelling

Well you can always find things like that if you look.

On 9/11 everyone was talking how nobody could have foreseen someone flying an aircraft into a building like that.

10 years prior Tom Clancy wrote about just that, just a different target.

Face it a lot of nuts out there already know in the back of their minds WHAT they want to do.

They just need someone else to tell them how.

And Kasper, if you believe voting won't do anything, just what do you think NOT voting will do?

I'm sorry to say I know many who seem to feel the same way. I think the biggest thing that sticks in my "craw" is people who don't register to vote because they don't want to deal with jury duty.

An then you have those that do everything they can to get out of jury duty when it's their time.

Many are the same people that whine about the judicial system, and yet aren't willing to deal with a simple responsibility of our society.

Many say Bush wasnt supposed to win presidency in 2000. Thats one vague example that cant really be confirmed. I dont believe voting will change anything because every poilitician put in office is a mere puppet. One guy said vote Ron Paul in...the freakin media got rid of his run before it even started because hes the one person who knew what was going on and probally couldnt have his mind changed. And they knew if he was put in office, then killed like Kenndy....it would spark massive outrage and investigation like never before. Im not saying i believe in ALL of the conspiracy theories but there are never so many coincidences regarding certain topics unless someone is making them happen, their just too far fetched. Its too late to vote, that America is long gone. And for anyone who says, oh thats a bunch of bull, thats crazy, thats just because they dont like being made fools out of when they blindly follow whatever road their told too. It pisses them off deep down because its attacking their beliefs and basically its like saying their too dumb to have realized it so instead of having an open mind and searching for knowledge instead of the next Iphone release date, they just dismiss it as bull like the mainstream media does. Im not calling anyone dumb, im saying learn. No one knows everything and im sure im wrong about alot of things. But the thing is im willing to search for knowledge eternally and ask for help when someone knows more about something than i do. We have the internet which is a gateway to more information than what the media feeds us so use it before they find a reason to take this away from us too. Im not a tinfoil hat wearing idiot who wants to be build a bomb shelter and hide. Im a grown man with a brain who will stand and fight and die for what i believe in. So before anyone even starts tryna attack me, ask yourself this: What is so bad about people like me, is it we choose to go agaisnt the grain and that makes you feel inferior because your not brave enough to do it, or is it you just dont want to beleive that your involved in a fight for your right and yes, your soul, and you rather ignore whats happening because you dont want to give up the life you have. Would you rather live in lies, or die for the truth?

First I don't own an I phone and I rarely believe all of what I hear anywhere. And never from one or two sources.

So much information over the internet is twisted to serve whatever purpose the sender has.

Just gotta love what people really believe, just today I got an email forwarded from my wife talking about another new Muslim stamp Obama has ordered commissioned and how we should all boycott it.

First only one stamp celebrating a Muslim Holiday has ever been commissioned. What's wrong with that?, I use Christmas stamps.

I wouldn't buy a stamp celebrating a Muslim holiday simply because I am not Muslim, anymore than I would expect a Muslim to buy a stamp celebrating the birthday of Jesus.

Anyway, the point is a lot of people were getting excited over something that has no basis in truth.

I can't truly say I've "never blindly followed anyone in my life" as I have followed the orders of several officers during my time in the military without knowing exactly why I should.

Different situation however, those men earned my respect and trust as leaders previously, and where not asking me to do anything I wasn't there for in the first place.

I don't know of anyone since then that has been able to lead me anywhere I did not wish to go.

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And Kasper, if you believe voting won't do anything, just what do you think NOT voting will do?<!-/Quote-!>

I have to wonder just how do you perceive that question as being an attack on you?

I also have to wonder just why you'd question me about what I believe, or whether I'm willing to go the distance over something in which I believe.

You know nothing about me, I know nothing about you, and simply typing something in a forum doesn't mean you know all there is to know about yourself.

You seem to have a fixation with fighting and dying for your beliefs.

I remember my wife asking me a question once after a show we'd watched on TV (don't even remember what it was).

She jokingly asked if I would be willing to take a bullet for her. I answered her the only way I could.

I would if I had time to realize what was going on, the instinct for survival in everyone is strong. I only know that if I didn't I would have a hard time living with myself afterwards.

I have a history which would lead me to think I could die for certain things in which I believe, but until that time actually comes, that is something I cannot truthfully answer should there be a choice.

A "brave" man/woman is not someone that is afraid of nothing. Bravery comes when a person is still able to function when terrified.

Me saying before anyone attacks me wasnt meant for only you, it was meant for anyone reading like the guy earlier in this thread who said something about port arthur and a guy said people like you make me sick. I guess you believe 911 was an inside job. I know by me saying what i said, it will open the door for criticism, and i was putting that to rest before it even got started. As far as you Yankee, the only statements meant for you was the Bush in 2000 line, and that voting wont do anything. I just continued on my own statements meant for any and everyone reading. I dont know you and vice versa. And fixation for fighting and dying for beliefs has always and always will be a part of life. War will never be eradicated, voilence will never cease until Christ comes back ( At least in my opinion ). Others may believe it wont be stopped until the goverment steps in, which is dumb as hell. But of course me beleiving in God may seem dumb to others so i cant and dont judge. Then some beleive crime will never stop because evil exist in all men in some form or other.

I dont beleive every conspiracy i hear. But from years of research an studying for hours and hours on in even loosing sleep, i have discovered something the masses miss alot. And if its not the so called "Illuminati", then its just regular people playing a joke and it has no real meaning at all other than something humans thought would be cool. If thats the case then cool, whatever. But when it ties into real life murders and mysteries, thats when shit gets real.
And like i said, no one can deny a music video by a known rapper thats accused of being part of this "group", having 12 skelotons in a movie theature and putting their hands over their ears as if there are gun shots. Coincidence, could be, but doubtful. This is only the begining of the things, 911, princess Diana, its just way too much history. And hey, i may be wrong but what if im not. What if everything thats happening is spot on and real. Then well, pray to whatever God you worship or become religious because theres a storm coming ( Watch the Batman trailor and you will hear Anne Hathaway say those exact words. But this isnt fear mongering, and i defintly hope this is all just a game that some smart people do to get attention. Im a normal person who wants to get married, have children, live life and have fun. I dont want to think of a world like all that. I enjoy playing simcountry and watching tv, i enjoy loving my beautiful girlfriend and seeing her smile. I want peace and for everyone to be happy. But thats just not what the world is all about. In my opinion, God is real, the bible is True, and the Dark knight has indeed Risen. Others may have their own beleifs and i respect that. And i ask for the same respect from them, and not to be called crazy, stupid, or whatever.

I dont care if you have an Iphone or not, once again i was speaking of the world at large, not specific people on an online game. I told you, only thing meant for you and you alone was that voting wont do much because anyone put in power is manipulated or killed who dont abide by their plans.

Guns can be banned. Poof. Just like that. No biggie.

It's only gun-loving NRA nuts who actually believe that the American Government will take your rights away without them.

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It's only gun-loving NRA nuts who actually believe that the American Government will take your rights away without them.<!-/Quote-!>

Except of course for our right to firearms right?

I wonder what the next right would be ... I'm sure it would involve privacy and mandatory chipping of humans, oh wait they already do that.

Or maybe it would only deal with unlawful search and seizure, or detention ... damned I forgot the Patriot Act does that.

Darn okay maybe just the unlawful seizure of property by the Government? Oh no ... Kasper is right it's already to late.

I don't vote because I don't want to be responsible for putting an asshole in office ITS ALL YOU VOTERS WHO HAVE RUINED THIS COUNTY

plus 1 yankee

@Yankee,

by your logic, if you're allowed to legally own guns, you should have the right to kill whoever you please as well.

Laws exist to protect people, not hurt them. Stricter gun controls are no exception.

What a load of horseshit!

I should have the right to do whatever I want as long, as it does not infringe on the rights of another.

Killing someone just because I "wanted to" would definitely be infringing on the rights of someone else.

Even in a situation where I felt I had to kill someone in defense, I'd immediately become involved in the judicial system.

If not all the criteria for the use of lethal force where obvious, more than likely I'd be the one sitting in prison maybe even with a sentence of death.

That is most certainly one of the more asinine statements I've ever seen for anyone advocating gun control.

And there's the rub...

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I should have the right to do whatever I want as long, as it does not infringe on the rights of another. <!-/Quote-!>

Every human has the right to life. Do you have the right to take away that right?

Please dont use the excuse that a perp has lost his rights when he is certainly going to take away yours. That doesn't wash, reminds me of a bad cliche - two wrongs dont make a right.

So is the death penalty taking away your right to life? Would you be justified in taking the lives of the executioners as they were about to take yours? (should such a scenario ever occour).

I smell double standards there, the law is an ass.

But I'm keeping out of this...