Simcountry
Forum Suggestions Capitalistic Nature of this Game

Capitalistic Nature of this Game

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Marshal Trumm
12 May 2012 18:03 Link
Yes, SuperSoldier. The Soviet Union traded and had money. But you guys don't seem to get the fact that National Proletarianism DOESN'T USE CURRENCY, and removes the need for trading between entities. My theory states that if you are a diligent and hard worker, you can obtain nearly anything you want simply by asking for it; why would you need to trade? If all you do is trade and exploit others, contributing nothing to your society but greed, then you don't deserve anything but your life anyway!
You guys are acting as if National Proletarianism is some outlandish dream that violates the laws of science. In fact, no rules would be broken. Nobody will go faster than the speed of light. I am not proposing that we divide by 0, or create and destroy matter or energy with no regard to the laws of conservation; it's perfectly simple: As long as there are animals and plants to provide us with food, we will always need farmers to run the operations. As long as there are farmers and farms, we will always need farm equipment. As long as we need farm equipment, we will always need workers and factories to MAKE the farm equipment. As long as there are workers and factories to make the farm equipment, we will always need other factories to MAKE the parts and tools that go into making the farm equipment! I think you can see where I'm going with this. In order to make all the tools and parts for the equipment, we will always need the metals, plastics, and other materials from which the parts and tools are made. This creates jobs in mining.
...chain-reaction...
In the end, everyone needs to be fed, housed, educated, clothed, etc...
This is the principle that my theory operates on. As long as there are people with needs to be met, we will always need each other to help us provide for those needs, and as long as everyone works together and contributes, all needs will be met; no laws of science have been violated by this theory.
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maclean
13 May 2012 01:14 Link
One of the laws of physics that would be violated is your justice system. If everyone had to act as jury on every case, with 3-day response time on each case, there wouldn't be enough minutes in a day to do this, even if the proletariat did nothing but vote 24 hours day and night without food, drink, or sleep. This would have a domino effect as no agriculture or manufacturing would take place.
And what happens when 1 billion people decide they want, say, i-phones? If you manufactured 100,000 per day (which I bet you couldn't) it would take 25-30 years to make that many.
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Xyooj
13 May 2012 09:13 Link
@maclean, that's what i thought about simcountry too. the political system does not have any affect on the game. even if the political system of the country affect how you manage your countries, i still think the GM will not have enough staff to know the intercacies of each type of political systems anyway.

@marshal, if i'm understanding your philosophy correctly, you're proposing that we go back to the age where if i'm a chicken farmer and you're a duck farmer, then if i want to eat duck then i come ask you and you want chicken then you come ask me? or we can trade between ducks and chickens? the problem with this system i see is that my chicken may weight more than your duck, so will you trade two ducks for one of my chickens? if we disagree on the trading terms, then you'll just have to eat ducks and i'll just have to eat chicken only? unless of course if you and i have competitors that we can go to, without bothering each other?

and i highly doubt that you would give your ducks away for free, if a thousands of people come to ask for free? my understanding of communism system is that no matter how hard you work, you get the same as someone else who sits around or done nothing. that is perhaps the downfall of the communism system. in a capitalism society, you want to earn more then you have to work more. a problem of this is that the rich will use their money to hire others to work, and the rich does not have to work at all to earn a living (if they're rich enough). the good thing is that it's not a slave system, everyone has a choice to work or not to work for a certain rich person.

when i said we need a common denometer, that is the currency we operate on. whatever system out there, there must be a common denometer to make it work. even the physics of changing one form of energy into another form requires a common denometer, which is the converting machine.
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Marshal Trumm
14 May 2012 20:30 Link
Maclean: It takes 30 seconds to cast a vote. Citizens would just have three days to cast it. Besides, voting would not be compulsory. It violates no laws of physics. In fact, a similar justice system was employed in the Greek city-state of Athens.

Xyooj: You are not understanding my philosophy correctly. Individuals would not conduct any trade with each other. The following is a more accurate scenario:
You are a farmer that works hard to feed the people of your town. Because a great number of workers depend on your farm for food, you are one of the most respected members of your community. Because the State owns all means of production, the distribution of the food that you produce would be conducted by the local government. The local government would maintain a stockpile of your surplus (in other words, you would keep all the food that you need to feed yourself and your family, and you would give the rest to the local government). This stockpile would be distributed (as needed) to the workers who need them. In exchange, you would have access to any product that you want or need. Let's say that you wanted a truck. In that case, you would go to a local government office, fill out some paperwork, and the government would then arrange for the truck to be delivered to your farm. You would get a free truck because you feed the workers; in exchange, the workers operate factories to provide for your own needs as well. And this would be true regardless of what your occupation is. If you are a hard-working member of the community, you will be respected because you're labor is what fuels the powerful system that is National Proletarianism. If you are a hard-working mechanic that does a good job, and there is a good that you want or need, the local government would be obligated to provide you with that good in exchange for your labor. So in essence, everyone works for the State, and the State provides for all.

However, if you don't work, or if you are not working hard enough, you should not expect as much support from the government. This is what creates work incentive in National Proletarianism: You only get out of the system what you put into it. If you don't work at all, then you will only be provided with the bare necessities (Housing: probably a 1-room dwelling with nothing inside it but a stove, a faucet with running water, and a toilet. Food: only enough food to keep starvation at bay. You would have naught but your faucet water to drink). This will create the work incentive that communism lacks. Your basic needs are basic rights; you need to work if you want anything extra.
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Marshal Trumm
14 May 2012 20:48 Link
Xyooj: Both capitalism and communism are just terrible. You point your fingers at communists with the accusation that they point guns at their people and force them to work, but capitalists do the exact same thing. The only difference is that communists use guns, and capitalists use starvation. In capitalism, you are forced to compete with your fellow workers in a society of social darwinism; capitalism makes human beings compete and fight each other like animals. Under a capitalist regime, you either work or you starve to death. Capitalism kills just as many people as communism, and the only difference is that communism kills you quickly and painlessly with a gun, and capitalism makes you agonize and suffer by starving you. Given the choice, I'll take the gun over starvation any day!

National Proletarianism is just a solution that I am engineering to fix these problems with the existing systems. I just think that all of the unnecessary death should stop. Human beings should not be forced to compete with each other just to make a living and survive, nor should people be forced to work at gunpoint. Both capitalism and communism just downright suck!
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maclean
14 May 2012 22:56 Link
Population: (Hypothetical world): 5Billion
Crimes per day: (Very conservatively) 0.001%
Total crimes per 24 hr period: 50,000
@ 30 seconds per vote, 24 hrs in a day: 2880 votes per day. thus, nearly 95% will not be voted on, and can claim injustice somewhere along the line. and the three-day limit is reaaly just an illusion, since cases would back-log so fast, there would never be any time except the 30 seconds before expiration.
And this is assuming everyone makes a decision in 10 seconds as to guilt or innocence. Deliver me from such a system. What would happen is that a small segment of the populace would dedicate all their free time to voting, while most would want to spend time with family, sleep, etc. This would amount to a cadre of highly influential citizens who may or may not be able to be swayed by rewards or threats. If voting is not mandatory, that would be the outcome. If voting was made mandatory, see original comment on collapse of economy.
Keep thinking it over; you may get the bugs worked out. No first draft is perfect. :)
I tried to figure out this same kind of thing when I was a young whippersnapper, so I know whereof I speak.
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Xyooj
15 May 2012 06:09 Link
@marshal,
very interesting philosophical system of government. i think your system may would work very well when you can engineer human beings to live like robots and any undesireable genetic traits as judged by yourself to be eliminated. as long as the billions of genetic differences within the human beings continue to exist, i highly doubt that your vision for that kind of government will work. i suppose you can get some research data to verify that titles do not mean much to some people. i think it's safe to say most people care much more about survival, power, and influence?

your example of the farmer, what if he only produce enough for his own family or what metric is use to determine what is enough for his family?

who will be the people running the government? unless these people are robots who have no flavoritism towards any person, then that may work. otherwise human beings will always try to provide more to those closest to them. the beauty of life is in the number of colors/differences within the system. if the whole system is but one color, what beauty is there?

i grew up part of my early life in communist society, my father was a community leader and greatly respected by the communist leaders. he said communism is only good for you if you are willing to kill your own family members, should any of them does not follow or are disloyal to the communist party. i'm sure you heard of the practices by Maosedong of China or Stalin of USSR? it's a great system when you're one of the enlite running the system.

capitalism at least does not make you a slave, should you choose not to be. i do think that people who're living a capitalistic society don't appreciate what they have, until the live in the other systems. being an observer, everything may look beautiful. but living it may be different.

as far as i'm aware there is no government system similar to what you proposed on planet earth, so perhaps something to experiment in sim worlds :)

whatever your religious belief is, i do believe that as living organisms we humans evolved. how do i know that, because my son who is only 3 years old can read already and speak very well. compare to me at that age, i would be consider retarded. his intellects i do think have something to do with me and my wife being very intelligent through schoolings :)
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Drew
15 May 2012 19:45 Link
Well this argument is being run by spin doctors, ahhhh.

I am a communist and i try to spin my country that way also, but the solution to make the game more balanced and to have more options is gone about the wrong way:

1. Money is needed! The goal of a communist society is first self reliance, then bolstering the proleteriat, that's why their are so many inequitecies involved here. You want to run a communist society then NO public corps and corps shouldn't use cash, they should all share from the feds budget.

2. Communism isn't democratic, Democracy is tyranny Socrates->Plato->Aristotle-&Nicomedes->Kant->Mill->Marx. The will of the majority creates a tyranny the non effatic voter votes for personal interest, not the benefit of the majority. Whether it's labeled or not in the communist manifesto the other ideals supported a certain level of authoratativeness. No so-called communist state has utilized the solution of public welfare, but I have a solution =), anywho the point of 2 is whether you want to a capitilist inhumane country, communist, or fascist has to be delivered through a constitution of sorts, that enable many different options that actually cause a difference to your country. <-that's the in-game change needed (constitional articles would probably have to be multiple choice and probably need a seperate thread then this one)

3. China claims to be a democracy but it is a aristocray. Which would be another potential constutional group of articles, then are at the heart of capitilism and the free market, having few that control wealth can satisfy all needs in an export society, doesn't work for America but the repug's don't get that. Tax the rich to pay for everything, they have the money to start all the jobs, and give the bare essentials for survival. (of course in simcountry that would be the ideal government because the immigration in this game seems very very broken)

4. Communism is rooted in so much efficiency that it doesn't get credit for because of piss poor examples. but i didn't know how to get to this forum and the biggest efficiency boost would be my company merger poll suggestion. It would also hold true in capitilist societies but... all production is owned by the state and so it would be much more efficient if inputs (fmu's, services, etc) financial position didn't matter and the cost could be swallowed up by the outputs (like umm... cars or something).

5. The reason the existence of ideals exist for the proletariat because capitilism has proved one thing over and over again that it cannot properly value their labor. we are the 99%! well not me anymore but a neccessity of communism would be to allow the allocation of value based on work. Even without the communist lean suggestion (and needed) this concept is still broken! Supply and demand consume this game but... there is no supply and demand for labor! This game uses a dictatorship method to determine employment outputs. That isn't capitilism that isn't communism that is supreme authoratitiveness, and not present in any industrial country. So the easy suggestion to allow for more appeasment to the commie, and more real world for the piggy, is to allow % changes to the base pay of individual labor postitions. (this would also have to be accompanied by medium labor will shift to low if their incomes are too comparable, and the same for others, but it should be easy enough)

6. So everything aside communism is intended to be for the betterment of the people as a whole. So it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever that enterprises control special clinics and back to work schools. Who is more vested? The country or the CEO? I like the idea of no work, no eat, but... social security destroys my index. I mean with an employment rate of 96% i shouldn't have to be destroyed just because the few that can't find work because of a shortage of low level workers refuse to give up their medium level status. You work you eat, allow the country to invest in special clinics, and back to work schools and actually make a social safety net unlike the non existant one now. Let's see what was the point of this one, so yeah umm... allow countries to control the things that countries control in the real world, and make social security determinant on the welfare of the majority!

7. I know I keep rambling, but in order to fix the inadequacies and establish a root of communism in this game quite a few measures need to be taken and they don't seem to difficult either. The imporant key thing that most communists don't realize or choose to ignore is that communism was always meant to be temporary. To correct socio economical imbalances and raise the economy. In my believe even if you strike democracy out of the equation done right it still will outperform capitilism at every turn. So one must be able to able to ammend their constution and riots should exist for them doing so. But the goal would obviously be to alter the constitution to develop a communist state that has policies assured for permenance. But the ability to cater your policies to your situation brings on greater levels of efficiency.

Yeah so that's it, corrections to the post, and the proper way to bring communist option to simcountry, i also believe there should be fascism aristogracy, and oligarchy also.

Oops I almost forgot one more thing, a state corp is ran by a country and an enterprise is run by a few investors that allocate small amounts of their wealth to a corp whichh corp has more growth potential? That's right an entire nation supporting a corp should definately have a quality boost before an enterprise does. Don't know how to go about that one, with a huge change of local corps springing up, states or enterprises purchasing them, and that would be way too large of processing power, but supports capitilism hugely.
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Marshal Trumm
16 May 2012 18:25 Link
Maclean: Nobody is required to vote. Anyone is allowed to vote, but that doesn't mean they have to actually sit in at court the whole 3 days. Besides, they don't even have to vote. For example, if there is a murder trial, the only voters will probably be the family of the victim, or friends...Like I said, nobody is violating physics.

Xyooj: Read the manifesto before you even say anything more because you have no idea what you're talking about.

Drew: My system is NOT communism. You fail.
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maclean
17 May 2012 05:18 Link
"Our judicial courts would be directly democratic. We would have no juries,
because court cases would be voted on directly by the People; any citizen who
wishes to vote "innocent" or "guilty", would be allowed to. This is because we
believe that a twelve-person jury is not sufficient for representing the opinion of the
People, for how can twelve people represent the opinions of the millions of
residents who might disagree? Let the People speak for themselves!They need no
jury to represent them. Each case should have a voting period of three days, and
after three days, the votes should be counted up and tallied. The fate of the criminal
would depend on nothing more than a simple majority. This will also avoid the
problem of using the letter of the law to defeat the purpose of the law."
"Nobody is required to vote. Anyone is allowed to vote, but that doesn't mean they have to actually sit in at court the whole 3 days. Besides, they don't even have to vote. For example, if there is a murder trial, the only voters will probably be the family of the victim, or friends..."
__________________________________________
Read this again and explain whether you are saying that a jury of 12 is always insufficient, or if you are saying that a jury of millions is better, or are you saying that a jury of 2 or 3 is sufficient. Also, what of the victim who has no friends or family, and no one is interested in his trial? What about someone who kills another man because that second man is in the middle of raping and killing the first man's family?
As for time of trial, I am assuming there is a system of online voting, etc., that takes only 30 seconds to log in and vote. You will still never get a fair trial and verdict in a majority of cases; either no one bothered to vote, or worse, voted willy-nilly without paying any attention to the trial, or could be swayed by elegant rhetoric to turn loose a guilty man, or execute an innocent one. Note that I am not saying that our current system is flawless, far from it. But there are worse ones out there.
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Drew
17 May 2012 05:19 Link
I never said it did, but i was reading and reading and i gave up when I noticed it was just bickering about history and current events, and most contains falsities. You were defending communism, mediocrely so I figured I'd do you a favor and give suggestions to give players alternatives to capitalism, not only communism but as a commie myself it is what i'd highlight.

BTW- you're making implied suggestions, dealt on misunderstandings. The problem with capitilism isn't competition it's the lack of. A corp will buy out competitors or merge with them, too allow themselves to inflict consumer harrassment in the form of price tags. Communism also was never intended to be a forced labor camp either you work you eat was the intent. So your post is backwards, communism you starve captilism you get ripped off and stolen from.

So you fail! national proletariat you have no idea what those words mean obviously.
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Xyooj
17 May 2012 10:33 Link
@marshal,
good luck at your political system :)

i doubt you even understand what you written though!!!

humans have not evolved to be honest, compassionate, and perfect in every spects yet. give a few billion years and maybe your system can be tested.

anyways, as you said, if someone ask for something, others in your system would give. so from a simcountry player to a simcountry player, can you please give me say 10T SC$? :)
this be a test of your political system

thank you :)
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Crafty
17 May 2012 13:02 Link
Idleness is the stupidity of the body, and stupidity is the idleness of the mind.
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Gunther Shamus
20 May 2012 01:02 Link
Marshall your system does not seem like a place where I would want to live and I would fight it to the death if the country where I reside decided to partake in this fallacy
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Gunther Shamus
20 May 2012 01:03 Link
and I agree with maclean the judicial system would be terrible I shouldn't be allowed to vote on something that I'm not required to learn anything about
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Scarlet
21 May 2012 02:53 Link
<!-Quote-!>Quote:

your system does not seem like a place where I would want to live and I would fight it to the death if the country where I reside decided to partake in this fallacy<!-/Quote-!>

QFT.
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Jojo the Hun
21 May 2012 05:39 Link
What's wrong with trading stuff?
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Marshal Trumm
04 Jun 2012 19:37 Link
I have not been online lately, so sorry for my delayed response.

maclean: This judicial system worked pretty well in ancient Athens, so why wouldn't it work anywhere else?

Gunther: That is your opinion. If the country adopts my system, then leave. It's that simple.

Jojo the Hun: Trading is a form of exploitation.

Everyone: Look, I understand if you don't agree with my opinions or my system, but I should still be allowed to employ National Proletarianism in this game...we should have lots of options...there could be a capitalist option in which we play the game the way it's played now, there could be a communist option in which we employ Marxism, there could be a Fascist option, and there could also be an option for National Proletarianism, where the country uses my system. Nobody can say that my system doesn't work until it's tested!
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Yesman
27 Jun 2012 05:36 Link
You guys are funny. You should realize that each system has both positives and negatives and rely on the culture within them for success. Pushing Communism or even strong socialism on a country like America where love of competition and individuality is like forcing a wolf to eat a salad. Highly populated areas must have some kind of capitalism to reach it's potential due to the lack of sense of obligation of citizens for fellow citizens. Communism and socialism work well in small, tight-knit communities BECAUSE of the sense of obligation for each other that people have in said communities. Capitalism in such communities however would usually result in a couple of extremely rich people within the area while the rest would be left the poorest of the poor due to the wealthy soaking up everything of monetary value (Wealth usually grows exponentially with capitalism). I'll never understand why people demonize a mercantile system or why they think the entire world should be dominated by one in particular. Capitalism is great under the right circumstances. People work hard, are very intuitive, and tend to develop many of the worlds' industries much faster under capitalism than other economic systems. On the other hand, Socialistic and Communistic social structures can in many cases, cultivate a better social and creative environment. People within well run socialistic communities are, surprise surprise, more social and communal toward each other. There is a greater sense of family and kinship between its citizens. Forget words like "exploitation". You sound like a lazy person who doesn't want to work as hard as others to make what they make. That may be far from the truth but it's the impression you make when you use damning words such as that in place of compensation. Compensation for ability, compensation for opportunity, compensation for hard work, these are good things. On the flip side, if you want a system that diminishes monetary importance in favor of a community focus beyond the immediate family then that is not bad either. Just understand everyone has different desires and values. Each type of government or mercantile system uses and gives a platform to specific ones. None of them are better or worse than the others, there is just proper and improper placement of each based on the size of community and the dynamics of the people within them.
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maclean
27 Jun 2012 15:01 Link
Marshall: the judicial system in Athens worked only because there were relatvely few citizens. In a country like China with over 1 billion, it would be a total disaster and impossible to implement anyway. as for trading being exploitation, words fail me...If I have 100 sheep that are eating my land into a desert, and I need wheat for bread, and my neighbor has more wheat than he can ever consume in any form, and is slavering for a joint of mutton, where is the exploitation if I give him a bunch of sheep which are doing me no good, and he gives me wheat, which is valuless to him? OK, "trading" at gunpoint could be exploitation, but I assume that's not what you are talking about, since that is not really trade. Explain how trade is exploitation, please.
Yesman: at the risk of sounding like a "yes-man" in the classical sense, you make some good points. I would allow that the one form of socialism that has worked well is the kibbutz system in Israel, and that appears to be a unique case.
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Marshal Trumm
27 Jun 2012 16:06 Link
Maclean: Regarding the judicial system, like I said, nobody is required to vote. If they have a problem with getting people to vote, perhaps they will throw a little reward in with it as incentive, but this is a finer detail that can be tweaked until it works. Trading is exploitation because you are taking advantage of another person's situation. In the example of the farmer with the wheat, you are still taking advantage of his predicament. Conversely, he is taking advantage of your own. Sounds like exploitation to me.
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Drew
28 Jun 2012 03:28 Link
Yesman you are completely accurate. But that doesn't mean that the system can't be shifted. Modern day capitilism doesn't inspire any creativity as the only one's with the resources are the uncreative.

If a communist BASED system can be shifted to allow for motivation then it would prove to be superior. And as I pointed out before communism is conceived to have temporary roots that most so-called communists especially Americans don't understand. If America would adopt such a culture for 10-15 years you would see a golden age to the extent the world has never seen before. As the creatives will have the resources to actualize their potential. Which reaffirms the problems with capitilism, why innovate if only the financial system will profit from them. There are obvious exemptions to this like mark zuckerberg but i would put the creativity of the american citizen up against anyone else in the world.
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Marshal Trumm
28 Jun 2012 04:23 Link
Finally!!! Somebody with some COMMON SENSE!!! Thank you, Drew!
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maclean
28 Jun 2012 19:54 Link
Marshall: Reward people for casting a vote in a criminal case?? (remember, we are talking about jury trials here, not whether to allow casual Fridays). [sarcasm alert]Oh, that won't lead to corruption and a perversion of justice! Bribery causing someone to alter his vote? Never happen! You have to think this out to its inevitable outcome. Either I and 5.9 Billion people are cynical and out of touch with human nature, or you and a couple hundred million are naive. no offense.
Mutual exploitation: Example: You need a blood transfusion immediately to stay alive. I need food immediately to stay alive. I have your blood type, and you have more food than you even want. Loads of it. So it is mutual exploitation if we trade? Land's sake, sonny, think these things thru! In this case and the other one I mentioned, both parties are benefitting, NOT being exploited. Mutual exploitation, forsooth! How would anyone survive under your form of government? Everyone, somewhere along the line, has to trade something; it violates the laws of reality not to, unless your whole society is a society of psychopathic savage hermits, and even then some trading is gonna take place at some level, you can bet. Forbidding trade on the grounds that both parties are being exploited is the epitome of the jack-booted nanny state on the neck of the People.
@Drew: I agree with most of the last part of what you say, but I have to take issue with the idea that once you get some wealth, creativity disappears. People with an incentive are creative, yes; that doesn't atrophy once they benefit from their creativity. i am leaving out the trust-fund elite; they are what would seem to prove your point, but they are the vast minority. I will state my views again to clarify; responsible capitalism is the best form of economic system to increase the well-being of the citizenry. This includes a safety net for those who need it ( not those who just want it), and enlightened self-interest could be utilized to do this without coercive taxation. The inflexibilities of Communism, and the confiscation of wealth, with unequal redistribution (common to both communism and socialism), while sounding good in theory, stifles the human spirit both as an economic system and as a governmental system, except in a few isolated cases (the aforementioned kibbutz system, for example).
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Marshal Trumm
28 Jun 2012 21:52 Link
maclean: You completely misunderstand the system itself.

Regarding the courts, what I proposed is not bribery because the citizens would be rewarded the same, regardless of what their vote actually was. It wouldn't matter what their vote is, they would get the reward all the same as long as they vote at all. This is not a bribe. A bribe would be if the citizens were rewarded ONLY if they found the defendant guilty (just for example), but they would not be rewarded for finding the defendant not guilty. THAT would be a bribe. You see the difference? The state doesn't care whether the citizens find the defendant guilty or not; the state only cares that the citizens vote at all. That is the difference.

As for trading, I suppose that trade would still take place, but it would not be in the form that you are most familiar. I should have mentioned this to clarify in the Manifesto, but the Manifesto is only referring to PRIVATE trade between individuals. We would only be abolishing the most familiar form of trade, where I have five chickens and you have two cows, and I give you three chickens for a cow. That would be abolished. A different form of trade would take its place. This form of trade is where every citizen trades his or her labor for the products that they want and need. Furthermore, it would all be run by the state (similar to communism). This is to say that, in exchange for your labor and contributions to your collective community, your community pays it back by providing you with the goods that you want and need. Let's return to the example of the farmer. He contributes his labor and his surplus produce to the local community, and the community rewards him by giving the farmer whatever products he requests from them.
"But how do you know the community will reward him," you ask?
To this, I will respond by pointing out that if the community doesn't reward the farmer, then he will not have the necessary resources to operate his farm. Now, that farmer is the one who feeds everyone else, so they absolutely NEED to make sure that the farm is operating, or else everybody starves! That is the incentive. And this is not a threat that the farmer actively makes. The farmer doesn't say, "Okay, I'm pissed so nobody eats today." This is just a matter of the farmer not having the resources he needs to run his farm, making him unable to produce enough food to feed everyone. Additionally, the community also needs to make sure that the farmer is happy. So in addition to the getting the resources he needs to run his farm, the farmer will also get any other products he requests, and the community will provide these goods so that he has incentive to work in the first place. So, there would really be two trade agreements happening: Firstly, the farmer would be trading his SURPLUS PRODUCE to the community in exchange for the supplies he needs to run his farm (the necessities). Secondly, the farmer would be trading his LABOR for whatever other goods he requests (his own personal needs and wants).
Allow me to illustrate the concept of this system. Suppose that you are a blacksmith, and you live in a national proletarian community. All of the other workers in the community need metal tools in order to do their own jobs. So, the local government commissions you to make tools for all of the workers who need them. What happens here is that you trade the tools you make for the supplies you need to produce them. But even having these supplies will not necessarily give you any real incentive to run your smith in the first place. So to give you a reason to work at all, the government commissions you a second time. This time, you are trading your labor for your own personal needs and wants. Does that make it clear?
So I suppose I need to revise the Manifesto, because you are correct in saying that we cannot abolish ALL trade. Rather, we are abolishing trade in its most familiar form. We would abolish private trade. This means that the only legal trading would be between an individual and the local government (or the local community if we are referring to the more anarchic version of this system). So everybody works for the government, and the government provides for everyone who works.
As a result, we would have absolutely no need for currency at all. This is also part of the national proletarian philosophy. Under this system, material goods have absolutely no value at all. Not even gold or diamonds would have value. Sure, these materials are certainly in limited supply, but what the heck do people use gold for, other than for coins (remember, no currency in my system), or jewelery? Gold only has a few practical uses, and it would only be used in a practical manner. Even when gold is used, such as in electrical wiring, it would be used in a way that benefits everyone, and it would not just be made into useless gold bars and traded by people who are pretending that it's worth something it really isn't. Diamonds also have practical uses, due to its hardness. Diamond would only be serving a practical purpose, and would not be wasted by making it into jewelery.

Now that I have cleared that all up, what is your opinion?