The New Little Upsilon Order: Fact vs. Fiction

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Question 1:

Please explain this statement to me and please point out how this is not dictating.... "The NLUO governs all of LU." This is what Hezzy is telling players like Josias, Mizore, and Crafty. This is what is upsetting them. <!-/Quote-!>

"The NLUO governs all of LU." This would be the vision of the founder of NLUO. It is an admirable vision. There is a need for more cooperation of players within LU to make for a more interesting and interactive game. Players on LU will ultimately decide on participating internally and voicing their opinions and using the government to expand their ideas on a global platform. Or they will choose to participate outside of it, either from a neutral standpoint, or by taking an adversarial decision.

What upsets certain players outside of the government is of little to no concern to the government itself, for the government reserves the right to pursue its own objectives without regard to how non-members 'feel' about certain aspects of the NLUO.

If any player wants to be heard by or influence the government, then perhaps they should join, and make their mark on the way the government is run in the way that participating NLUO members do.

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Question 2:

Is the NLUO not a cohesive effort? If so, then how can Steven Ryan decide on his own to issue war decs? <!-/Quote-!>

There is a process for declaring war within the government. To my knowledge, this was brought up and almost initiated.

However Steven Ryan declared on Josias because he chose to. Not because he was ordered to. All members of the NLUO reserve the right to protect themselves at all times. And the Hydra thread qualifies as a valid reason fr Steven Ryan to declare war, because the Organization he is a part of, was threatened, and perhaps he felt threatened himself.

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Questions 3a, b and c

Given attempts at diplomacy the other night in chat with Josias and Mizore and Hezzy's alluding to that some agreement would be forthcoming...

a. Were discussions presented to all of NLUO?

b. Was there a vote that was agreed on by the majority of the NLUO for this war declaration?

I am rather concerned that Hezzy alludes to an agreement of sorts and then just hours later a war dec was issued. Seems inconsistent with the impression I was left with the other evening.


c. Who all voted Yes to war and which of the nations voted No? <!-/Quote-!>

To begin, Josias never initiated any form of diplomacy. He attempted to dictate to the government how it would act and tried to force compliance through threats of violence. So therefore this is not a valid question.

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a. Were discussions presented to all of NLUO?<!-/Quote-!>

The span in which discussions took place publicly and privately on the forums and/or chat did not realistically allow for every single member to be informed about the events as they were happening in real time. Players do not always log in at the same time and there are other factors that you I know are well aware of. As many as were present and reading the forums were likely involved in any internal discussions about what may or may not have taken place.

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b. Was there a vote that was agreed on by the majority of the NLUO for this war declaration?<!-/Quote-!>

This is information privy to members of the government. I cannot confirm nor deny any of what you ask.

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c. Who all voted Yes to war and which of the nations voted No? <!-/Quote-!>

Again, this is information privy to members of the government, and for obvious security reasons, the results of any vote which may or may not have taken place cannot be shared outside the government membership.

Gaz is Blueserpent, End of story... not that anyone cares. Just pointing out the obvious.

Ok then im blueserpent.

Duh...

Wendy, Gaz is not Blueserpent. Where did you get this notion???? How is this obvious?

I know Rob well, how he chats, how he talks, everything about him. This is not he. If it is, I would be very surprised. Dunno why I feel a need to defend him. lol

Thank you for answering my questions, Wendyloo. I dunno if I agree wif everything, but that is what makes Simcountry so great!

I'm not sure if I am still sure about things or if I agree with the vision of governing an entire world.

I suppose it will end up people counterring if they dun agree. I just hope that people keep the drama "game" and not make personal attacks. I hate seeing this. :-(

Well things should be interesting for a while on LU.

My best to you all!

Question: People still war in this game?

Question: Is this war going to spread into the other planets, or is it staying on LU?

This is perhaps the most boring thread in history.

.......why must you burst my bubble?

Tom is perhaps the most boring player EVER in SC history. That guy that logs in once and never logged in again is running a close second.

So Tom how goes Simnations or whatever they call it? Must not be too great since you ended up back here lamer than ever, huh? I guess the grass isn't always greener on the other side after all?

Tallisibeth, The NLUO would like to prevent wars like this in future and as a principle.

However, naturally, we cannot predict when instigators will force a player's hand.

Also, the NLUO does not extend past the realm of Little Upsilon. Therefore we cannot comment on the possibility of any wars on other worlds. Although I would venture to guess the answer is no.

Lis,

It isn't the NLUO that you have to fear.... It is I, KISS OF DEATH, that you need to fear. *giggles :P

It was great to have you stop by chat last night. Come back more often!!!!

Excellent piece of spin there Wendy, I congratulate you. There you have showed your mastery of the skill, especially your reply 1. In fact, 1 is not really spin, it's a genuine point. And there is no Brit sarcasm intended there.

Now the other points...I call for some transparency in the govts decision making process before I could possibly make an informed decision to ally my nations with it or not. The NLUO legislature is in the public domain. It declares there will be a set process before any war is declared. Was this process followed, or is the legislature not worth the paper it is written on. The NLUO published this legislature, will it now say that it abides by it or not.
Agreed, the NLUO has the right to keep individual members voting preference a secret, but if it desires to do this, then the voting process needs to be independantly monitored and verified.

Madam secretary, you say Mr. Steve Ryan has the right to defend himself if he feels threatened, indeed he does. But is not the ideology of the NLUO to solve international disputes with diplomacy hence bringing peace and prosperity to LU. As a member of NLUO, Mr. Ryan should have bought his fears up to the executive of NLUO where all avenues of diplomacy should have been explored. Secondly, a vote of the members of the NLUO should have been taken with Mr. Ryan agreeing to abide by the final decision. Isn't that what your legislation requires? The testament of some NLUO members is that this process wasn't followed.

So, do NLUO abide by their own legislation or is it actually a free for all with only a few of the heirarchy benefitting, maybe at the expense of other members who are not so influencial?

Do the NLUO agree to have independant verification and monitoring of it's voting process to assure all members and non-members of it's adherence to it's own rules.

I only ask this to avoid another rogue federation forming to the detriment of the game as a whole, in particular players on LU. If the motives of the NLUO are genuinely what they are stated to be then surely this would be seen by the whole of LU as proof of their good intentions, leading to no more suspicion or hostility. I am sure that this is what NLUO desire. Who knows, the federations of The FED and DNAliens may be convinced to support NLUO intentions.

Lastly, do the NLUO reserve the right to use nuclear and biological weapons to ensure it's authority, or will they publicly state their opposition to their use. In other words, how peaceful are they really in pursuit of their utopian vision for LU?

The ball is in NLUO court as far as persuading the players of LU of their peaceful, cooperative growth of LU. From your track record, you will probably say that NLUO dont give a tinkers cuss about persuading non-members. I request you to think again, look at all the arguements and their causes, only the Executives of NLUO can direct it in the right diretion. Use your powers of persuasion and arguement to make NLUO work like it was originally intended, with noble ambitions.

President Crafty. Central Scrutinizer.
Chairman of TheFED.
Chairman of DNAliens.
Several time HOF member.
Several time member of the security council of LU.

Dang..........CRAFTY!!! You are like my real life boss!!! So many danged titles. :P

LOL, they are just my game titles...

Hey, question: If you are an earl and you get an OBE, do you become an earlobe?

Crafty, I have to spend like 5 whole minutes dissecting that post in order to respond to it. Yeah a whole 5 minutes! Are you aware of how many empires and ceos worth of maintenance I have to do when I log in? I can't make a full time job of it.


But ok... here we go....

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Now the other points...I call for some transparency in the govts decision making process before I could possibly make an informed decision to ally my nations with it or not. The NLUO legislature is in the public domain. It declares there will be a set process before any war is declared. Was this process followed, or is the legislature not worth the paper it is written on. The NLUO published this legislature, will it now say that it abides by it or not.
Agreed, the NLUO has the right to keep individual members voting preference a secret, but if it desires to do this, then the voting process needs to be independantly monitored and verified. <!-/Quote-!>

The NLUO reserves the right to keep any matter secret it chooses to. Any matters that are disclosed to the public will be the result of an INTERNAL decision to disclose such matters and not a moment sooner.

Regarding voting and independent verification: This is a decision that would be made by the NLUO, again, INTERNALLY and not a moment sooner.

Why do you presume to think you can dictate how another group conducts affairs? This makes no sense to me. Has the NLUO or any other organization in this game ever told you how you will or should run the FED, and to make your internal issues public, and that someone outside the organization should monitor your votes? You weren't really serious were you?

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Madam secretary, you say Mr. Steve Ryan has the right to defend himself if he feels threatened, indeed he does. But is not the ideology of the NLUO to solve international disputes with diplomacy hence bringing peace and prosperity to LU. As a member of NLUO, Mr. Ryan should have bought his fears up to the executive of NLUO where all avenues of diplomacy should have been explored. Secondly, a vote of the members of the NLUO should have been taken with Mr. Ryan agreeing to abide by the final decision. Isn't that what your legislation requires? The testament of some NLUO members is that this process wasn't followed. <!-/Quote-!>

In short, again you begin to presume to know what must or must not be done in order for President Ryan to defend himself. Ultimately, this is his right regardless of how even the NLUO feels about it. And more importantly, this goes back to the accusation that the NLUO is forcing itself on Presidents.

Clearly that is not the case because even though the NLUO would prefer a diplomatic resolution to any armed conflict, the NLUO cannot Force President Ryan, or President Orbiter to lay down any arms, call off any wars, or any other action that is the will of the individual player. The NLUO is not 'forcing' itself on any President. Member or non-member.

Furthermore, the NLUO has not declared war on anyone.

Diplomacy was offered to Josias by myself in person while in chat face to face and he flat out rejected the idea stating, "I'm looking forward to this fight" or something along those lines. I could dig for the log, but I'm knee deep in answering your post.

There is no testament by any NLUO members to the contrary, I am not sure what you mean by that.

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So, do NLUO abide by their own legislation or is it actually a free for all with only a few of the heirarchy benefitting, maybe at the expense of other members who are not so influencial?<!-/Quote-!>

The NLUO is a democratic organization, in times of emergency, I am sure improvisation will have to take precedence. At the time of this recent commotion, the Government was not filled, there were vacant posts and the real time speed of deteriorating relations between the supposed "hydra" actors and the NLUO may or may not have allowed for normal procedures to be followed. As with any new upstart, processes and procedures will be formed as the NLUO makes every attempt to cover its' bases.

Bottom line is, it will be sorted out internally and discussed likewise internally and not carried out in the public arena. As is the norm for any other organization that ever existed like ... ever.

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I only ask this to avoid another rogue federation forming to the detriment of the game as a whole, in particular players on LU.<!-/Quote-!>

How is it that you and you alone Crafty have left your position as an equal partner with all other Presidents on LU and elevated yourself to a position where you can determine what organization or federation is or is not "rogue" at your sole discretion?

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Lastly, do the NLUO reserve the right to use nuclear and biological weapons to ensure it's authority, or will they publicly state their opposition to their use. In other words, how peaceful are they really in pursuit of their utopian vision for LU?<!-/Quote-!>

The NLUO is not a military organization. This was never the ideal nor the outcome hoped for. however the NLUO should be full of members that reserve the right to defend the NLUO and themselves using whatever means they see fit. The question is not valid.