Gun law

my final post. hey Drew, you're the kinda guy who gets his teeth knocked out by someone like me for that mouth of yours and you don't understand why. wish i had all that money back payed in fines for those good times. nah, second thought, it was worth every cent. something not understood is me and those like me never fought anything for people like you Drew. we fought for loved ones. to keep them safe at all cost was the biggest reason. i'm proud to say i have 4 sons who followed that path as well and all saw iraq. still have one in afganistan for that matter. something you wouldn't know about but it's something special to swap war stories with a son who almost came home in a box. it gives you a better appeciation for life and your loved ones as well. if you never had a near death expierience from combat you can not even begin to understand where i'm comeing from. my family along with friends celebrate independence day for what it is. but we also mourne for those who payed the price so we could have our freedom. many don't understand nor even care for that fact. i'm all that's left of an elite unit formed back in the late 70's. a search and destroy/search and rescue team. maybe they wouldn't have had to die if those terrorists hadn't tried to blow up an airport on foreign soil. but we got the call and responded. a story i've only shared with my wife but i saw them all fall as i was pinned down under heavy fire. nothing i could do which still tears at my heart. long story short, i lost it, went insane. i remember thinking that this was it. had my whole life flash in front of my eyes and decided to go down hard. i jumped up fireing and yelling and had out of body expierience if you can believe that. i was looking down on that person. wish i could tell more but that's all i remember. 3 months later i wake up in hospital. i was always known and still am known for getting the job done. i got the job done that day as well. even if i don't have any memory as to how. my point being, you won't find this in any history book. many things happen simular to this only blocks away from crowded areas but in most cases they are in and out before anyone knows what happened. no need for you to be made aware as well. why have you panic over something that's already gone down. many people wear rose colored glasses. the sooner you take them off the more you'll see. i could tell you all kinds of stories. but no good would come from it. i won't call any by name but i've worked for or with many orginizations and groups around the globe. many things go on behind the scenes that you'll never know about is my point. just be glad you have the freedom you have while you still can. many threaten that freedom each and every day and sometimes i agree with that old saying that ignorance truely is a bliss. i'm out. my best to you all.

Hey krash u dont have to worry about keeping anyone safe their in no danger its the countries that are invaded for money and oil there the ones fighting for thier lives.

Ok. Too many posts to read, so I'll outline what I meant when I said that stuff about Al Qaeda.

Amongst Al Qaeda's primary beliefs is that Israel should not be a recognised state, and that they are on Palestinian land. They see anyone who supports Israel as a target, thus 9/11. Crafty, saying that Israel and Sept. 11 aren't related is nieve.


Rick is making me angry...

"Take a poll, of the women sentenced to death by stoning in the upcoming months. Tell us what they did to deserve that and what they have to say about holding on to beliefs.

There is a primitive tribe in New Guinea that is still practicing cannibalism."

And should the West take it upon themselves to force their own views upon others with their own customs? No. How would you like it if Muslims invaded the USA and forced you to adopt their system of government, because I promise you it's the exact same in the Middle East.

Furthermore, I lived in New Guinea for 14 years. Having seen many of the local customs, I would prefer that many were left alone rather than degraded and spoilt by Western influence.

"@Tom Morgan

"And I'm not being insensitive." Why??..because you say your not.
"Just looking at it from a lateral point of view" Really, what's your lateral point of view?
"Every action has an equal and opposite reaction." In physics that's a true story.
The "entire Arab world" was not involved in the attack, Al Queda was.
And finally, the guy who "made them angry enough to fly planes into buildings", has left the planet.

Over three thousand people died that day Tom. Those people had very little to do with middle eastern politics.

I think your post is not only insensitive, it's offensive to normal sensibilities.

"America and Israel, who single-handedly have pissed off the entire Arab world."

Go back to the creation of Israel, you can practically reach back and touch it. Consider the history of armed conflict between Israel and it's Arab neighbors. Now give me an honest opinion, what do you think would be different today if America had withdrawn it's support of Israel at any given time?"

What would have been different? A less-arrogant Israel for one, who would've made solid peace deals with her neighbours and would be treating West Bank/Gaza Strip residents as human beings rather than dogs.

"Over three thousand people died that day Tom. Those people had very little to do with middle eastern politics."

And how do the many thousands more Palestinian women and children, who are unfortunate enough to be born into a life of relentless persecution by Israel, have a say? They themselves have no control over politics, but they are the ones killed by the situation forced upon them. And they outnumber the amount of Americans killed on 9/11. By far.

I know I felt horrible for the lives lost on 9/11, but I also feel for those who haven't been honoured and don't have ceremonies every year. Many people, just like you and I, are killed in the Palestinian region simply because its in the best interest of politicians in Washington to support Israel. Where's the fairness in that?

steve ryan, you know nothing about it. Nothing. (Remainder of post deleted by author as being probably inflammatory, and pointless)
@ Tom morgan: so then did you respect the native customs and chow down on "long pig", or not? If not, Why not? Don't you feel you should honor the customs of other cultures? (If you did partake, how was it? Did they serve him grilled or boiled? just curious )

26 as of today. Most people didn't undergo the lifestyle I lived at the time. why do you think I called them crazy and why i used different time continously. And when the conversation moves to socio-political grounds differences in income is the biggest issue holding us back. And as a well to do person, that wants taxes raised it was relevance. You call me spoiled yet if you search my beginnings you will see that my hometown has half the city as foreclosed homes, a graduation rate of under 50%, and tons of violent crime. You simply want me to look bad just because it makes you look dominate in the discussion thats stupid. Assuming I had no way of learning to defend myself is a simple baseless arguments. I worked hard to get the things I wanted for myself.

And Krash it's unfornuate the things that have befalled you, and you have my condolecsenses however it doesn't change the truth. The things you and your family had done weren't to ensure our way of life. Too clarify it is possible the special things you have done may have been, but isn't neccessarily innocent by our government to begin with. The wars we were involved were not from any source that threatened to take our land, or our rights. No fight we have been in wasn't provoked by us first (Revolutionary war excluded). Even WW2 we were supplying weapons to the allied forces. WW2 I do support our interference, but the cold war, the gulf war, the recent middle eastern situations, the vietnam war, the cuba missile crisis. Were all born by us challenging the freedoms of other countries. I will never serve an army that has false objectives. Not because I don't love my country, not because I'm afraid or lazy, but because I myself can't be a part of something that destroys peoples lives for other people's gain. Like I said you have my condolecsenses, but not everyone who serves knows the intent of a war, not everyone who serves is a defender of justice, not everyone who serves is a good person. Anyone who would piss on the bodies of defeated soliders, or runs around killing civilians in the night is scum. If that what it takes to be a good American that I'd leave this country before adhering to that. But thanks for the good wishes

Oh yeah and a terrorist organization should have no root in u attacking a country. @ Maclean, And I agree America should partake in humantarian efforts but only within reason, if Americans are struggling then other countries come secondary

I agree drew we need to be more isolationist.

but don't blame the soldiers or the country because its actually the politicians and government

tom I'm becoming angry you are defending evil backward parts of societys in the name of respecting culture....and its not the same in the middle east at all those people are being subjugated by sadistic narcissist men who were a bigger threat to their own Muslim culture then America ever was you think afgahnistan wanted to be ruled by the Taliban? no the Taliban forced upon the populace an extremist form of sharia law and they outlawed many practices that were once part of typikal afgahnistan culture what did we do force elections upon them?

and kasper your being a bigot

Shut up T. You cant justify 9/11 by saying AQ didnt like US supported Israel. The Israel situation seems extremely complex. I do not fully understand it and what I do hear reported is going to biased, but so far I can see both sides of that fight.

And the muslim world did aggressively take over a large chunk of the world. They finally ran out of steam in southern Europe. You know how close GB became to being Muslim? Sharia law is practiced here and the good old tolerant Brits turn a blind eye to a lot of it. Only recently are we clamping down on forced marriages and honour killings.

But thats all irrelevant. You and drew are sounding the naive here. Yankee called drew out and I say the same to you, its a shame I have to be like that because I like the brief convos we normally have on lighter topics. Yous both use the same old high school debating group ideas. Get wise guys.

Whats GB?

By the way, back to the original point of this thread, there was another shooting today thats making headlines

GB - Great Britain, with an emphasis on 'Great'.

Ohhh. Do ya'll watch American College Football there? I've been wondering this, i know you can see the Superbowl.

Some games are shown but the time difference and the fact football (American style) is young here make it a bit obscure. Not big time, no, like I dont know anyone who could talk about it. Even NFL games.

I was in San Francisco when the '49ers won the Superbowl. Wow, what a street party that night.

I also managed to get the Raiders home games on satellite in a bar I worked security in, against all the NBC, ABC etc networks saying it couldn't be done. Their execs came to the bar to see it for themselves! Packed the place I did, then they jammed it

My States won the last 3 National Titles. I love football. I need to find someone in this game i can talk ball with. Are you from here or did you just visit a while or do some work here?

Spent 7 years there. SoCal. Sorry, cant talk much about football, no knowledge, but I know there are a lot of big fans on here.

Southern Cal? Holy crap, their voted to go to the BCS this year, of course that is if they run the gaunlet. My Bama is pretty much the reigning Kings of college ball right now. Had several players go in the first round of the NFL draft this year. Im hoping we can pull it off another year. Im loving it! Anyway i was just curious.

Kasper, I would also direct you to Serpent for ball discussions. He and a player named Slade loved talkin' sports. Although I am not sure if Slade is still in the game. They growled when I tried to turn the convos to girlie topics. lol

If you wish to ever discuss shoes, I'm always available. :P

Another good Sim Deed today. A referral. :-)

Hopefully they'll find their way to the conversation. If not, i'll defintly be posting a thread about Spetember 1st. Kick off day is amongst us

Tom and Drew,

I took a course in semantics a long while ago.
The professor said this one day.

"Consider everything you don't and can't know about everything."

When you give that statement some thought I believe you have to acknowledge it is accurate.

It is so accurate a person could think there wasn't very much at all that he was qualified to discuss in an intelligent manner.

But that is hardly ever the case. We discuss, debate and argue about almost anything.

The problem, as I see it, is that people start using absolute statements. Absolute statements rather preclude discussion and create an argument without end.

So Tom, I don't know why I was making you angry.
For the most part I was asking why you felt the way you do and a couple of statements I thought were just plane false.

Your quote:
"What would have been different? A less-arrogant Israel for one, who would've made solid peace deals with her neighbours and would be treating West Bank/Gaza Strip residents as human beings rather than dogs."

Do you think there could be any chance Israel would have ceased to exist?

Rick, accordig to David Hume, we have no way of understanding anything we don't experience. Everything we think of our ideas, (that come from our experiences in some way or another) and they build several volitions (combinitions of ideas that form basically an opinion), and finally we make our judgements based on those volitions.

When people don't gain new experience they will not grow a more concise volition to make better judgements. In other words sometimes you have to be involved in stuff you know absoletely nothing about. Sometimes to get a full understanding you still need to share complete nonsense that makes sense to you. But you are partially right (absolute statements) many people lock their volitions in place and are resistant to new ideas. To summarize there is nothing wrong speaking with absolution as long as you aren't closing off your mind to new ideas.

Sorry it was kind of long mostly off target, it took a bit to get to the point i was trying to make, and I even had to condense it quite a bit

"And get a spell checker, my spell checker is tired of having to correct your quotes."
Plane=Plain
=)

Drew, I agree with David Hume, and most of what you had to say. I would guess that that is pretty much how the thought process works, or should work.

I still take exception to absolutes. I think the message there is "This is the way it is, no room for discussion."

If a person has an open mind, why would they be speaking in absolutes in the first place?

And use your spell checker. It's plane to see you'll only make as many mistakes as me.