W3C - Game news July 2

You help us when you complain about a specific problem.
sometime we discover errors.

In this case, the FMU corporation had major fluctuations before the change of the immediate orders. Profit is already increasing a bit and will increase more.

The services corporation and some more but not many corporations on all the worlds, are now selling smaller amounts of immediate orders and the price they receive can average lower.

The drop in immediate orders was very steep but the numbers will start to increase again.
The number of immediate orders coming to your corporations is unstable. sometimes there are none, and sometimes many. If there is a huge product shortage, the chance is higher you get some.

Keep watching your corporations, and you will see profits increasing beyond previous levels.

Country and enterprise income will increase.
In countries, mainly corporate income will increase while tax income will remain unchanged or even decline.

the economy will depend a little more on income from corporations rather than on taxes on the population.

We can look at the numbers again in 2 or 3 days.

I don't like in this game:


For each corps to have it profitable you have to create contract for high quality service and high quality tech service and put all other products order on 120 and it will make more income that corp that use all RM on 200 quality.


If you don't do that your corps will just drain your money it is not important how good countries stats are or anything else.


And when you building more and more corps you should start earning real money but if you don't do that up you will just lose trillions.

i lost the will for setting this, and also losing will to playing game


One suggestion
Add booster for corp quality
for example
Booster will increase corp Quality of the Product for 30 in next 1 game year. Or something like that.

Thanks Andy, it appears that the situation is gradually improving. Enterprise is now turning a small profit again.

Andy

The GM wants FB to be able to supply the other worlds with strategic bombers to make aircraft maintenance units. Which i can understand and agree with your logic on that. But the only problem here is that the corp itself only makes 1 stealth bomber a year meaning it would take DOZENS if not 100+ corps to be able to make even single planetary market.

Id like to propose to the GM of increasing the corporations production to 2-3 planes a year. On the sole fact that that's the ONLY world in which we can make them.

Looking @ the costs i figure
1bomber a year = 10B a year @ 120Q
2bombers a year should be around 6B
3bombers a year should be around 4B.

Really this wouln't do any real harm to the economy of the bombers market, but it would allow players to make more and be able to seem to many players and allow others to open new corps without the fear of shortage.

Also a stealth bomber corp only makes 2 bombers a year. Can the GM looking to doubling these productions in order to allow us to trade these weapons more frequently. The demand among players is there but production is MUCH to low to allow markets to thrive

i dont agree that the c3 raiding cash is to high...to even set up a halfway dececnt defense it cost lots of cash, to maintain a decent defense it definetly takes raiding because i think many would agree that our own countries cant make enough profit to defend it self and have any money left over to invest or expand, unless you have over a 70 mil pop counry or so. but even that is getting harder to do. so saying we need to make less dosent sound right to me because that would mean to maintain the same defense i would have to raid even more. i would ask that you readjust to the raid values of last week when war level 6 made 6T it would be much appreciated by me

It is a question of what is intended.

Is it meant for raiding to be the undisputed master of generating cash?

In an environment where the costs of all products have been forced down, is it supposed to be that raiding's purchasing power shall increase by virtue of its income remaining the same?

Indeed, purchasing the necessary weapons and ammo for defense can be quite costly but these needs are shared by all countries. Should raiding be the primary requisite to obtain and maintain the military to defend yourself or should players who achieve creating successful economies generate similar funds for their defense?


I would favor an account raiding limit per world. Say no more than four cash awards from raiding per world per real week. I like it for these reasons:

1. It would act to make economies more important and somewhat balance country/CEO income with raiding. Raiding would still hold a considerable place in the game in generating cash.

2. It would reward raising war levels. War level 3 would cap at 2.7 * 4=10.8T but war level 6 would cap at 5.4 * 4=21.6T/week.

3. It makes a base level of raiding income more accessible to more players over further reductions to C3 award amounts.

Aries

you talking on a point that's proven to be to costly ALREADY.

The issue isn;t limiting it but rather the overhead cost.

I just PROVED to you that it costs 2T in anti air missiles ALONE. Why don't you war and count all those mid range, all those weapons YOU lose then tell me with an honest answer that income isn't high enough.

My problem isnt that i want to make an econ based on warring, I've NEVER stated that fact remember who trained you and PRIDES himself on production, I've proven that economies make more then warring, so before throwing out a load of bullshit have facts to back it up.

My Problem with the income is that its not enough to even compensate the cost of the war. War level 11 was added when you could buy 370 with no problem and weapons had a bit more strength.

My problem is that C3 MAGICALLY POOF weapons and ammo from no where, and they are of such a high Q that players have to spend a ton to even compete. Not to mention they preform MORE attacks then even a player. As i stated the ONLY reason i wanted income increased was because of this fact. If the GM where to revise the Q and amount of units in these wars id have no problem with the reduction.

But as it stands its MUCH to costly to war. Over a dozen vets have stated it costs ALOT

45K Anti air @ 300Q = 1.9T
100K Mid Range @ 300Q = 6.7T

Thats 8.6T, even if you cut that in HALF thats still 4.3T and your making just under 10T.

Count all the weapons lost, the ammo for tanks/artillery, ect. Your lucky to break even.

Moving up the war levels should come with some reward. It gives small score boost and a one time offer of GC thats it. An easier compensation instead of cash would be pop.

Instead of giving a cash increase what about a pop increase? 1M people per war level?

War level 11= 10T cash and a 25M pop nation. that be WAY worth the cost of moving up even worth long term warring.

Get some cash and maybe a few million pop. Thats something we can all agree that be worth moving up the war levels right?

some of us prefer the war game over the econ game...i wouldnt play this game if all i could do was wait around for my econ to pruduce enough money to war lol .....and 4 wars a week BORING and not for me.

Lol now posts are being deleted

Find another problem I forgot about,
1 Cant mass delete messages.
2 Cant buy or sell shares from portfolio page
can only do them from corp page.

1. I do raid. I have to. Anyone who wants to poke their head above war level 2 requires the income only raiding can provide.

2. Facts to back up economy vs. raiding.

Melichor total monthly income ~155B
If all 7 of your countries made such income ~1.1T

Two days of generating econ income vs. 20 minutes of raiding (defeating one war level 9 C3).

2.2T (econ 2 days) vs. 9T

Costs have been omitted but I would bet that the profit margin favors raiding. Still interested to see your full raiding cost analysis.

Melichor monthly cost ~150B. Net income ~5B/month


3. You have a problem with C3s magically generating a military but they also magically generate cash as well when defeated. The amount of cash they generate is also very considerable. Consider:

Melichor's corps employ nearly 81 million hard working citizens. In a game months time, they produce goods and services worth $680B. In a game years time (two real days) they produce just over $8T which could be considered Melichor's GDP. This entire year's production can be purchased from the cash award of one level 9 C3. This would be like the United States raiding a country with the population of Bolivia and acquiring the cash to pay back half of the national debt.


4. Raiding is already the source of the fastest population gain outside of buying it with gold coins

Train high tech execs
Trade for llws
???
Profit


5. 4 C3 cash awards/world/month. Find yourself on 4 worlds, that is 16 awards. Maybe diminishing returns could be the answer if one enjoys raiding C3s that much or we could just consider lowering raiding cash altogether.

Limiting the number of awards was just an idea but the imbalance compared to econ is real. Some people like the war game and some spend real time working on their economy and that is ok but the rewards should be comparable.

Alright. I finished a raid to figure my costs. I went air which is generally regarded as more expensive. I counted all ammo used and all weapons lost. This is against a war level 6 C3.

I used:

fighter missiles

5313 * 329 qua * 14.87m = $260B

precision bombers

266 * 444 qua * 434.16m = $513B

precision bombs

5878 * 315 qua * 14.61m = $271B

total weapons and ammo = $1044B


Cash reward of C3 = $5.4T
Cash from destroyed corps = $400B
Cash value of transferred products = $100B

Total reward: $5.9T
Net gain $5.9T - $1.05T = $4.85T

I also plan to transfer about 300k llws from this country and give about 22k high tech execs in return. Not bad for about 15 minutes work.

war level 6 is MUCH different then the higher war levels aries.

The difference between war level 11 and 6 is HUGE. Below i provided charts. The difference between war level 6-11 is that you have 4times as much interceptors and double the Q difference. Garrisons gain 2.5times there Q, instead of 1-120Q strealth bomber you have 30-450Q units and instead of a single attack they counter attack 2per time.

Why dont you redo the math and see what kind of profit you make. Also you used ONLY fighters/bombers no tanks or anything?

The C3 Army at War Level 6 Units Quality
LR Land Division: 2 160
Land Defense Division: 4 200
Small Supply Unit: 6 160
Large Supply Unit: 6 160
Defensive Helicopter Wings: 8 220
Interceptor Wings: 15 220
Air Force Attack Unit: 1 160
Attack and Bombing Wing: 2 160
1 response CA Stealth Bomber Wing: 1 120
Garrisons at all targets: Many 200


The C3 Army at War Level 11 Units Quality
LR Land Division: 2 200
Land Defense Division: 5 400
Small Supply Unit: 8 300
Large Supply Unit: 8 200
Defensive Helicopter Wings: 15 400
Interceptor Wings: 60 400
Air Force Attack Unit: 1 200
Attack and Bombing Wing: 2 200
2 responses Stealth Bomber Wing: 30 450
Garrisons at all targets: Many 500

Heres how i see it.

total weapons and ammo = $1044B
Double that because the Q of weapons doubled...
Now multiply that by 4 because there's 4 times as much weapons.

1044(base) * 2(Q effect) * 4(unit increase)= 8,352T
Plus dont forget i didnt include the lose weapons becuase of the double attack stealth bomber wings. and in the upper war levels you need ground troops so also didnt factor those in

8,352T of 9.9T

Ya thats pretty good money NOT going to lie, im sure those stealth wont suck up the left over money, you know the GLORIOUS 1.6T i could make

Yes, I used only fighters and bombers on the attack. I will admit, I forgot my interceptors had to deal with the stealth bombers costing me 34 of those worth $43.5B though I also understated the cash from the destroyed corps that makes up their cost along with their ammo. I also went on to take a second C3 netting me more than $9T after expenses from the two raids.

Edit: To the penny, I removed $11944.884B from the two countries before expenses.

You can do better than figuring your costs as some straight multiple of mine. I counted up my costs, lets see yours.

I will take a c3 tonight and give cost evaluations

I didn't know there was a restriction to buy population when your a free member :/

Yeah, it's the reason why I became a premium member.

EDIT: One of the reasons, actually.

Oh. I don't like it! I won a award and I want to use the rest of the GCs on population! And what are the other reasons? You want to rule the world? :P

.

War level 11 gives 9.9T income

My settings where as follows, to keep the theme of what you did i used an air attack like you did.

-Bomber wings 320Q
fighters 3missiles(300Q) per attack(300planes) over 60attacks = 2.4T
bombers 5bombs(300Q) per attack(100bombers) over 60attacks = 1.3T
45per attack losses(350Q/180M market price) over 60attacks = 1.7T
45per attack losses(350Q/324M base price) over 60attacks = 3T
Total cost 5.4T/6.7T(this is JUST the cost to clear 60wings of interceptors and nothing else)

-clear the garrisons
350bombers per attack to clear the garrisons times that by 50garrisons. Total cost is 77B per/3.8T total

-Destorying the target
150bombers per attack = 33B per target/1.65T total
TOTAL OVERHEAD COSTS = 10.85T(low side)
----THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE ANY AMMO OR LOSSES DUE TO STEALTH BOMBER WINGS COUNTER ATTACKS------
Although it takes 350fighter's per attack to clear a single bomber wing. There's 30 in total and during this time the game auto counter attacks with 2 attacks per 1 player attack. Additional added cost of ammo to clear stealth bombers = 1.45T

10.85T basic war costs + 1.45T stealth bomber removal = 12.3T

Again this DOES NOT INCLUDE!!! Any weapons lost for clearing the garrisons and this does not include any weapons lost due to stealth bomber counter attacks...

Ya i spend 12.3T and i make 9.9T

Thanks Aries i mean the 11T that i WAS making was SOOOOO much better, I'm just swimming in the cash and benefits of the upper war levels

First. My data was gathered by collecting the exact numbers of weapons and ammo before I attacked the C3. I then counted what was missing after without resupply. This is the way to know what is used. Easiest way is to disband your supply units.

Second. Your ammo use is overstated. I am sure you know that your unit stops using ammo when it is no longer effective against its target (generally when the opposing unit is destroyed). It does not use full ammo each attack.

Third. Make sure you add up corp cash.

Fourth. State the world this was done on. I will take a look.

#1
What part of STEALTH BOMBER COUNTER ATTACKS did you not understand. Theres 30units and they double attack meaning in the end after they are clear them all there's 60 attacks of so.(not counting those that happen before the airforce is down). Do you have ANY clue how much work it is to count the extra weapons and units? Also those are base numbers. If you didn't notice i happily included the amount of ammo each attack used per weapons, those aren't there for your health. I provided the number for reference then tallied the actual ammo used(in cash value).

#2
The ammo isn't overstated in fact sometimes it took more then one attack. It would only do 90% or so and i should have to use 10-20 more bombers but i didn't count that ammo because i was to lazy.( i did this war at 3-4AM.(you should feel special because i wanted to go to bed but stay up to prove a point)

#3
The country had 13 corps before the war. But this is a really stupid argument even if it had 20 corps at 40B that's 800B in cash. Still not even making a dent in the losses that one would incur.

#4
FB and ill send the nation to your LU inbox so you can see for yourself.

Wouldn't this be easier FOR YOU, to move up the war
levels and test this for yourself? I mean if your that skilled apparently and the profits that good why should someone of your talents be at such a low war level

I look forward to your message with the raid info.