Countries Debt

My country Atlas 1, on Tiny Atlas went From +1 trillion to -16 trillion in 16 game months. There were no unusual transactions. I went ahead and paid the debt off. Can anyone tell me what may have caused this. I'm now in the process of stripping the country and retiring it. I originally was going to try and keep it breathing until the planet became more active, but I am no longer filling the expense and time is worth it.
Any opinions on what may have happened would be appreciated.
Rob
Atlas 1
Tiny Atlas

With your secrecy settings active it’s hard to get a good look at what’s going on with your country as far as potential debt issues for an outside observer. The first thought on any other world (I haven’t touched TA so I honestly don’t know if it’s market behaves differently) is automatic purchases made by your country for desired products based on your market purchasing automation settings; though even in that instance it would be quite rare to have consistently 1T in purchases for multiple months in a row without it being something you are very aware of. Hopefully someone from TA can have some better input for you, otherwise if you turn off your finance secrecy I’ll be glad to see if I can’t help find something out of the ordinary in your reports, obviously no promises but I’ll give it an honest look to try.

Thanks removed secrecy settings. On Atlas automatic orders are not filled. Everything basically needs to be on contract, or shuttled over from the main empire. It was a steady 1 trillion a month, nothing unusual in what was being purchased. No new contracts, just a nice steady siphon.
I do appreciate you reading and responding to my post.
Rob

Looking in your Cash YTD info in your finances, I saw:

Cash/Debt Inherited from Conquered and Closed Countries -6,000,000.00M SC$

and opening up the graph showed that there was a steady 1T cost per month for that. Had you taken over another country on the world some time ago and let it fall into extreme debt? I'll admit it's been a long time since I've conquered and stripped a C3. I looked at a couple other players randomly on the world and they don't have that debt on their logs. I also noticed that a couple of the countries next to yours show available in a week as if they had been owned by someone and de-registered recently, so I'm hoping that's your culprit.

No that would have been Atlas 2 which was purchased. I did remove all the supplies before releasing the country. The country may have had a small debt, but nothing that would merit this type of siphon. Now the country did have supply shortages,I allowed this to happen to slow down the population growth originally. What I did not realize was the amount of supplies that went negative I would be responsible for upon its release. I'm assuming now that this is what occurred. It is my opinion that this is unfair and needs to be changed. If my country does not have the money or I simply choose not to purchase the items The Game should not purchase them or hold me responsible for them. The game has no right to put me at -2,000,000,000 tons of gasoline, milk, def weapons or whatever it may be. My country should just suffer the consequences. The game is not going to let me use any of these negative assets if attacked, but it's going to require me to back order everything first which could run into the multiple trillions. Atlas has no automatic ordering in place. To require us to micro manage every tiny necessity and then hold us in debt for not purchasing everything is completely unfair.
Andy you once posted that you read and will respond to every post. I would like to know your thought process in implementing this back ordering system. Why would you want any players to go into this type of debt?
Rob
Tiny Atlas
Atlas 1

Well at least we helped find the source of your issue, though obviously as just a fellow player I can't help look up the actual debts that Atlas 2 racked up to help any further. Hopefully Andy gives you some resolution.

I want to thank you Auditor for looking at my situation. I know this took some time. If I can return the help in the future, please do not hesitate to ask.
Rob
The Brain
Fearless Blue

I Went And Looked Into This. TA countries dont recycle correctly. if you go look at your old country you will see that all debts are still there instead of a clean wipe like it should be.

It is true that the reset process for abandoned countries is not working correctly on TA.

We are working on it right now.
This work is one of the factors delaying the upgrade we planned for last week.
we hope to upgrade later this week.

The 1T payments are caused by the payback of debt when corporations or countries are terminated.
This is done to prevent an empire from taking large loans in one country, moving the cash out and then terminate the country.

The termination process is paying all the debts and takes the money from the main country in the empire.

this function is part of Simcountry from the start.

Andy not being a math guy, There were no loans to the country. The courps were always flooded with cash upon closing the corps I bought all the remaining materials closed them and took the cash the following month. At least that is my normal process
The problem and I believe it's the same in all worlds. The game on its own purchases unwanted materials they then show up as a negative asset, requiring the players to buy all the back orders before they can purchase any usable product that were presently in the red. What happened with my country Atlas 2, I allowed the negative assets to remain. (food, energy, clothing, ect...) The game then added the totals and backed charged them to my remaining country.
Solutions Instead of taking the country into debt for unwanted materials
like Trucks, Jewelry, Household products ect Lower the Welfare and Migration index.
Instead of going negative on military assets like ammunition, Aircraft fuel, missiles. Lower the military unit or weapons quality one point for each game year not supplied.
Putting players into massive debt does no one any good, everyone loses. Including you. Think about how many have left the game just from this one issue. Personally I'm done with the past. So lets move forward and make this better for everyone
Rob
The Brain
Fearless Blue

Rob,

Countries should not have any negative amounts of goods.
this is a non existing situation.
you cannot have a negative number of bread or anything else.

so whatever cash there is, it is used to purchase materials.
when terminated, it will continue to close all shortages and will, if needed, push the negative cash to another country on the same world at a rate of 1T per game month.

I do not know all the details in your countries.

This will also prevent the stripping of a country of anything useful, get more out if possible and leave it with negative assets and then retire the country and get rid of negative assets.

the negative assets are your responsibility.
it should bring everything, if possible back to zero and then retire the country.
all the assets should be sold and the money retain3ed in other countries in the account.

Andy
1)Countries should not have negative amounts of goods.
My country Atlas 1 ON Tiny Atlas right now has negative goods, I'll just list a few. (1) Asset Maintenance -458,381 (2) Boats -88,032 (3) Book and News -353,571,411 (4)Cable TV 312,995 (5) Cars 244,583,274 (6) Cloths -18,5432,813 (7) Fish -19,279,225 (8) Furniture -1,307,303,658 (9)Gas -4,255,321 (10)Home Equipment -1,577,764,860. ect..........

I could go on perhaps 20 or more not listed. The countries cash on hand 7.26 Tril So the cash is not being used, because there is no open market on Tiny Atlas. But this problem exists on all worlds, The best example is shortages in Ammo.
Lets say I have 10,000 Tanks there is a mandatory amount of required ammo to be used each month. If there is a large shortage the order will not be filled, but the game will continue to reorder month over month resulting in a negative order some times in the millions this must be paid in full before you can receive anything positive. Lets say that I'm short on money and now choose not to order, but want to keep my equipment in case a war is declared. The game still orders and yes I will still be required to pay all the back orders before the order I now need is filled. Simply implying that as a President / king however one chooses to rule you should be able to control their purchasing. A player should not be allowed to accumulate negative assets in any products there should be another way rather through the welfare,finance, or defense index.
I'm not worried or concerned about the past. I know you are working in many areas of the game. I just believe this issue should be addressed at some point.
Rob

We are running countries on all worlds and we have no shortages.
if you allow automatic orders and allow 3% higher payment than market price, you get all you need.

on TA it is different.
you have to bring it all from the other worlds.

we have no shortages there and have a huge amounts of materials.

you need to decide if you want a country on TA or not.
if you keep it, better have it supplied.

we think that mainly on the 5 worlds, there should be no shortages.
the supply index is already updated, (months ago) to decline more if there are shortages.
it should decline even deeper.

Major changes underway for shortages of wind turbines. Read about it here, today.

That's fine Andy. I know you're doing the best you can.
Rob