Simcountry
Forum General Econ Players (Little Upsilon)

Econ Players (Little Upsilon)

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SuperSoldierRCP
27 May 2010 00:52 Link
Most war players can protect themselves, an econ player to have a 130fin index is tough and to have to save TRILLIONS per country and spend trillions to stay safe means that we have to find another steady ground. if half the game in WP its going to suck we are going to have much much more C3 warring and territory deputes WP should be temporary fix. Im only proposing ideas because the game was based on war then they made a flip and it wasn't though out enough. as Orbiter said it would cost 115B a month plus everything else i need even if i make 100B a month its going to take awhile and if i have a CEO or 2 it will make it more complex. We need and idea that would help Econ Players but at the same time not make it unfair whos to say a warlord switches to econ buy there decreased WP then flips back? their getting n easier ride. im trying to propose stuff to the admins beside WP tell me your thought... Each government has it own ability, new items, econ get 2 secure, econ players defaults get 20% more start production? a little idea will go along way...WP is a safety net for a short term fix not a long term solution
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White Darkness (Kebir Blue)
27 May 2010 03:50 Link
A 130 FI is tough? It's a breeze, unless you're supporting a military. Hemlock on any world isn't below 153 FI. No military, no need in a secured country.

Now if I ever want to go past 160FI I'm going to need to have over 100B in costs a month.
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Slade (Little Upsilon)
27 May 2010 05:27 Link
Um i thought we have a econ game, it's called CEO.
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CraftyCockney
27 May 2010 11:36 Link
With all due respect SS, you are new to this game and your lack of understanding shows. If I may just point out a couple of things:

If you have 2 countries, you can make one econ, with an FI of 150 - 160 (no military as WD points out), *(In fact, when you get established you can get an FI over 300). You then have a war country (slave) whose FI can drop to 110 or less and you have an empire average of 130. Remember: The level requirements are an average, you dont need 130 FI in all countries.

A good war slave or two will enable you run several good econ countries and be able to protect them on the whole. (No guarantees given :P ).

Making 100B a month is the minimum requirement for any non-war slave country, some make 500B+. CEOs do make things a bit more complicated, but can greatly increase your income and, ironically, can greatly assist your defense abilities. ;)

The issues regarding people abusing the 'spirit' of WP are different to your arguement about the econ Vs war game.

Personally I think you should use your skill and judgement to beat the game, not try to change the game to suit your ideals. But 10 out of 10 for at least thinking about things and long may you run.

Crafty
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 03:04 Link
Hi everyone, im fairly new to this game. and i was reading this forum, and i was like, what? financial services fee? so i looked into my financial statement and i was like WTF!!!, half a Trillion $ in one month. and im over here trying to get to level 9 wondering where my $ going not making money anymore. and it looks like it just increasing more and more(fees) while im tring to lower my cash to meet the limit before fees by puting it into loans. the last month they took $944,522,960,000 from me. WTF thats shady!
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 04:15 Link
continuing from my last entry. So i figured i that i should just go for the defensive level 9 instead of the peaceful lvl 9, but it seems like im ruining my slaves putting all that military into them. Maybe it cuz of the low pop. Any suggestions on what i should do cuz i dont know if im taking the right path. thanx
oh and to anyone that i have pissed off by taking over a corp, im truly sorry. After playing a bit i realized that it aint alright to take over someones corp. and if u want ur corps back, i will be more then happy to return them back.

Don Caballero
President of La Cartel de Michoacan
CEO of iNTeK Cartel Corp
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 07:11 Link
opps im tripN. financial services fee is for the year not the month, but still thats a lot
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SuperSoldierRCP (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 09:51 Link
i have a poll on the communications page... so you can voice your opinion
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CraftyCockney
28 May 2010 11:21 Link
Da Don, you do realise that you can put your excess cash (over about 12T before the Feds want their cut) into your direct trading account, like a nice little tax haven.

Also, if your holding that much loot in your slaves, you want to be sure you're packing plenty of heat, so don't sack your hitmen. There's always another mob ready to take control of your turf ;)

Crafty
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 12:09 Link
i got all my $ in my secure country. i only keep about 100B to 200B in my slaves. Thats why their rapping me on that financial services.
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 12:37 Link
oh on putting my cash in my direct trading acc. if i do that, i'll drop lvls cuz im still playing peaceful index until i get my defense up to lvl up to lvl 9. and i got to keep all my Trillions in my secure country cuz i aint tryN to get robed.

One more thing, is it possible to keep playing this game without paying everytime ur acct expires, cuz what is it 4 or 6 gc for every day after ur acct expires, thats crazy. or do i got this wrong?
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 12:41 Link
oh i voted on ur poll, SSrcp. i agree with u on that. 4sho
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BlueSerpent (White Giant)
28 May 2010 13:36 Link
Its possible to only pay annual membership if you can earn enough coins to extend ur empires. Its best if boosters are bought to extend empires, from mains and ceo's only.
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CraftyCockney (Kebir Blue)
28 May 2010 15:21 Link
Don, I dont think its going to make any difference to your levels by keeping excess cash in your main. Move it to your DT account and save yourself the fees.
It costs 1 GC a day to keep an empire (per world in otherwords) and 1 GC per day per enterprise. This is seperate from paying real money to have an account ($12/3months) for which I think you still get coins thought they did change the rules on that so I'm not certain.
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 15:25 Link
i'v gotten boosters, but never see my membership get extended. pay annual? how do u get that option cuz i dont see it or do you have to have a certain amount of gc for it to pop up?

well here is my acct status
You are a full member until June 17 2010.

(main entity)Your empire on LU (Mariposa, Yosemite National Park, La ...)
yours until Jun 17 2010 automatically extended with membership

Your enterprise on LU (iNTeK Cartel Corp)
yours until Jun 15 2010

sorry about being stupid on this, LOL, but they dont give us enough info on this.
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 15:33 Link
thanx for the replys. i'll move it to dt acct and see what happens.
D
Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 15:44 Link
so i can only put 12T in dt acct without getting an additional fee? is that what u were sayN, so if i exceed 12T in my dt acct they will start taxing that? LOL
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White Darkness (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 18:23 Link
Direct Trade account is unlimited. No fees. Use the cash to buy GCs, or whatever. :)

Nice to hear about your decision on corps, which I know you snagged one of mine, but not a problem. I was a little impressed to see someone new slip off with a corp by taking a dominant share holding. Not something you see every day. :)
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Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
28 May 2010 19:15 Link
White Darkness
Yeah, my bad, i remember doing that to one of ur corps. Then i looked into ur Empire and i was like wow i better not mess with him, before he comes over and kicks my azz;) and thanx, its nice to hear that u where impressed with a noob, yeah i never did that hostile bid thing. i knew from the beginning that aint cool at all, and that if i was going to take over it will be by buying shares on the market, and i went crazy buying on the market then i started mainly looking for corps that were failing and badly mismanaged by inactive players, to save.
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Laguna
29 May 2010 02:47 Link
This issue isn't a priority, but it is an issue.

It makes no sense sense to offer a peaceful game mode, and expect and suggest the player to become an highly appealing target vulnerable to war.

My usual recommendation in face of failed mechanisms, which offer trouble or nothing downstream, is to have them removed. So, one possible solution here is to have one single Game level scheme - like we had before.

However, given there are players who wish to play a peaceful game mode, and the addition of game levels as a requirement to build corporations compels them to rise through the Game levels, among other factors, an effort has to be made to resolve this situation. Also, it comes as a necessity to the Game to find a balance between a peaceful and war mode, if long-term success wants to be attained.

I see one main problem with the current mode: it asks for a Peaceful player to have one or more country susceptible to war. If a player chooses to play a Peaceful mode, he is obviously choosing not to participate in war, either as an attacker or as a defender or as an ally. There are other possible problems, but of smaller dimension, such as the accumulation of cash when confronted with Financial Services, and the feasibility of the requirement of high indexes.

To resolve the main problem, we can follow a number of solutions, but I'll only present two:

1. The "number of countries" requirement is changed to 1 on all levels.
This is very easy to do and doesn't imply many changes. To compensate for the facility, a number of new requirements specific to this scheme will be add, such as N number of X, Y and Z type of corps in the enterprises, N corps over K market value, some relation with the coming Natural Resources and others some such. Also, the country wouldn't be able to get out of secured mode, declare war and join a federation.

A player can only choose this scheme when it has only one country and doesn't belong to a federation. To avoid unnecessary discrepancies, the requirements for this scheme should be equal to the War scheme, when it is only necessary one country to advance to the next level. If one gets tired, one can change to the War scheme at any time.

This will greatly overlap Peaceful mode and Enterprise Mode, which comes with the extra expense of 30GC per month. But, given this already happens with the other schemes, it matters little.


2. Extend the number of countries in secured mode to three, to those who choose peaceful mode.
This provides security, doesn't make it too easy, and allows them to experience a bit the war engine, helping them to decide how to play the game.

A player can only choose this scheme if he has less than three countries and doesn't belong to a federation. One's able to change to the War scheme, if all countries have less than 400 defense force index and 100 Off index each.

I'm seeing one problem at the moment. A "peaceful" player can surround a Warmonger to give him coverage from land units. To null this tactic, all countries will have military access to the countries in this mode. This is arguable, and might not be done.


I thought of including - and even of indexing - the cost of war protection of this mode with the monthly membership cost, but it simply doesn't work fairly in a dynamic environment.


On the smaller problems, I feel little or nothing has to be done. Financial Services won't stop you, as the monthly profit will have to make more than compensate the fee - and you can always loan the money out to avoid it -, so they don't come as a definitive block on advancing through the Game levels. As for the indexes, I initially thought they were too high, but given there isn't the weight of the army to drain manpower, it is probably doable, but only time will can tell.


The question I have for everyone is this:
Which alternate scheme would you prefer for the peaceful Game levels and why? And which Game level scheme are you using now?
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White Darkness (Golden Rainbow)
29 May 2010 03:57 Link
Don ~ I'm still a fledgling myself. No dangers here. Maybe in a few hundred trillion military assets. When I realized what had happened, since I see my shares way too often on my enterprises, I had a brief flash of anger, then I started laughing. It was a slick move. You probably noticed I sold out.

Definitely not a big deal. If I can't appreciate a good tactic, it's time to close up shop.

Laguna ~ In my case, I'd consider both of those viable options.

My own situation is simple. In two of my operations (KB and GR) I'm sitting at level 4 peaceful. With the corporation level requirements, this gives me the most flexibility while I get things prepped over time for moving ahead. In my primary theater of operation (LU) I've switched to the war ranks finally and have moved rapidly from level 4 peaceful to level 8 military.

I'll admit I personally think all new players should be defaulted to the "peaceful" levels to encourage them to get their economies together. Up to 4, they're quite useful for country development.
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SuperSoldierRCP (Little Upsilon)
07 Jun 2010 07:49 Link
im still working on all these ideas n im come up with some good ones and laguna thanks for the ideas HUGE HELP. anyone have some mroe ideas and thanks to all for you inputs
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Senor Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
08 Jun 2010 23:12 Link
YIPPIE!!! I made it to LVL 9! Yup, its best if ECON players switch to defensive mode to reach higher LVLs. My goal is to reach #1 for both CEO and Country, within 70 years(Game years) of playing. Hopefully I can do it.
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Senor Don Caballero (Little Upsilon)
08 Jun 2010 23:24 Link
What is the best way to educate the low lvl worker, cuz I have way to many(1.5M)? More universities, high schools, or elementary schools?
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Serpent (Little Upsilon)
09 Jun 2010 04:34 Link
All the above. Uni's H.S and elem schools.