Wisconsin labor conflict (Kebir Blue)

Maybe you remember seeing something in the news a few months ago talking about Governor Scott Walker's plan to recover the economy in Wisconsin by cutting funding to education, selling power plants in Wisconsin to corporations, and, most controversially, removing the rights of collective bargaining. You may not have heard about this for a while, but as a student who helped organize a walkout at my school, I want to know what others think.

What if they *gasp* disagree with your own opinions!!!

Slashing education a bad idea, but hey, most educational systems in this country don't work anyway.

Power plants sold to private entities? Bet you the price of electricity will go up.

Collective bargaining? One of the few, already horrifically tied up in laws, defenses people have against exploitation.

if they disagree border then I'll debate with them.

The only debate BC knows is mass debate :p

naughty crafty

Well, I can see that this thread has already been hijacked, so I guess I should just stop checking on it.

There's probably not too many protesting school children from Winsconsin here is why you are not getting too much of a response Bill.

Good luck with it in real life though.

The private college prep school I went to had its tuition cost less than half what Wisconsin public schools get per student. I'd wager it gave a better education as well. Slash away. There's little, if any, correlation between higher per student education spending and better education.

Public sector employees don't need collective bargaining rights. This is why you have situations where the unions and the politicians receiving union support make ridiculous, impossible-to-pay-for deals that screw over taxpayers. Not all states require collective bargaining rights for public sector employees. Some states even outlaw it completely.

If he's selling the power plants to private companies, he'll need to make sure to deregulate the distributors and open up the process of building new plants. Otherwise, there might be an electricity crisis like in California (00-01).

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The private college prep school I went to had its tuition cost less than half what Wisconsin public schools get per student.<!-/Quote-!>

lol. When that happens, you are only paying a portion of your education cost with your tuition. The other portion comes from your Commie Pinko Government. Search for your school's financial annual report and see how much of their total costs is covered by tuitions. If they don't divulge theirs online, look for transfers at your local/state/federal/whatever budget.

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If he's selling the power plants to private companies, he'll need to make sure to deregulate the distributors and open up the process of building new plants. Otherwise, there might be an electricity crisis like in California (00-01).<!-/Quote-!>

That crisis was fabricated. Hello? That's what you get when you free a good that is public by nature. Can I get an amen from the classics?

I know that there aren't many Wisconsinites who play this game, but I wanted to see what other people thought.
Actually, collective bargaining is important. Without it, the government can freely cut salaries, and increase the amount the employees have to pay more towards things like pensions, medical insurance, etc. They have less money to spend, and the local economies suffer.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/02/wisconsin-gov-walker-ginned-up-budget-shortfall-to-undercut-worker-rights.php

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2011/03/10-6

"The utter disregard for the rule of law and daily revelations of hypocrisy are rapidly undermining Walker as his poll numbers continue to tank. After rejecting $800 million in transportation funds in order to kill a high-speed rail line that would have employed thousands, Walker is now begging for $150 million from the federal government for – that’s right – trains. After claiming that the state is broke, this week we discovered that Walker managed to spend $42,000 flying private jets around the state, and managed to scrape together the money to hire Randy Hopper’s girlfriend, giving her a 35% raise. After stating repeatedly that his union-busting bill had nothing to do with union busting, his Senate Majority Leader, Scott Fitzgerald, admitted this week that it was all about breaking the back of the unions. Wisconsinites are worried that the out-of-control Governor is sending the state off the rails." That's from commondreams.org, heres the link.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/03/31-3

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stories/2011/03/14/columbia-woman-gets-involved-madison-protest/

Don't bother with the article, that one is shit. The picture is what I wanted to show you.
The students in that picture are from Velma Hamilton Middle School, were I helped to organize a walkout. The teachers found out, and actually excused us from classes, as long as we had parental permission. I hadn't gotten there yet. Just wanted to show you.

I went to private school as well, and our tuition was also lower than the per pupil funding for the public schools in my area. However, my school (and most private schools) did not have to educate any one they did not want to educate.

Behavior problems? Expelled immediately.
Poor attendance/grades? Expelled.
No parental involvement? Expelled.
Special education services? Not accepted.
Admission for all? Nope. Approved applications only.

So sure, they could educate their hand-picked students at a lower cost than public schools who have to educate everyone. I'm not sure the comparison is valid though.

In contrast, in public schools, I have been bullied since third grade and have punched at least two people per year every year since fourth grade. The sad thing? Starting in the sixth grade, it was a series of verbal attacks over several months that drove me over the edge, except for grade 8. And the amazing thing? I get an in school suspension, and the pieces of shit just have to go to some thing with me and the counselor were they apologize. If they got suspensions, then the entire school would be out for a day. The only thing I ever did to deserve this was being the new kid. Fuck the public school system. Fuck society. Fuck everything. Even sadder is the fact that half of the kids in my English class take ten seconds to pronounce the word "diamond". And they pronounce it wrong. Again: fuck the public school system.

"Again: fuck the public school system."

Sounds like a good idea. The governor should slash their spending and remove CBA rather than throwing more good money after bad.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have a mass debate to get to.

BBJBS Your anger seems well founded. Your desire for change through a walkout might have also been well founded. What were your goals in the walk out? How did you go about organizing? Would you say you were successful and if so what did you achieve? What will you do in the future to bring about change?

As a community organizer myself, these are all questions that we ask and seek answers for. Unfortunately, most people don't see themsleves as game changers and sometimes even resort to violence (see Oslo). Being a leader involves developing relationships with those in power--teachers, parent groups, principals, pastors, education board members, etc.

Schools need -0- tolerance for bullying and a pro-active program for developing respect of peers, teachers, etc. This takes a big commitment on your part but it can be done. Find allies, know what you're talking about and recognize that before you win a victory, you'll make mistakes. But learn from those mistakes and make changes in strategies. All of us operate out of a self interest motive. What is in the self interest of those in your school(and there are many voices) to bring about change? Find that and you'll be half way there. But it ain't easy.

@ border: I believe that the actual reason that public schools suck so much is BECAUSE of low funding, due to the NCLB act, and now it's going to get even worse because they're going to have less money.
@ Parsifal: Our goals in the walkout were to convince Scott Walker and the rest of the Republicans NOT to pass this bill. Of course, Republicans rarely listen to mass opinion, facts, or what's best for anybody besides themselves. Basically it was word-of-mouth, meet at the breezeway after first hour, walk until we join up with the kids from West (local high school), then walk to the capitol and walk around with signs for the next couple of hours. It was that day that the photo above was taken, coincidentally. Although I'm not sure how that really has anything to do with it.

Dark secret of public education in the US funding, and I'm sure Wisconsin is just as bad as a former employer of mine, Tennessee.

Most of the money is wasted. The contracts to get supplies are "lowest bid" which either means lowest quality, or the price of each supply magically goes up about 300% after the contract is cut.

Sheer bureaucratic waste. Seriously, when you can't hire a secretary for a living wage, but it's okay to set up another contract to get 10 more "employees" who'll each make more than their "manager"?

I can't even remember how much of my section's budget was siphoned off to do "studies" that no one could understand but me. They'd spend a few 10s of millions and come out with some horrific drivel that would boil down to what I had been saying, but it took them 2 years to get there. Took me 10 minutes of observation in most cases.

Unnecessary levels in the chain of command. Need I say more?

Sports. I'm quite sure the schools are in the same bandwagon as the public universities, where about 25-35% of their budget goes to keeping their sports teams active. The rest is probably going to waste and upper echelon salaries.

And yeah, I'm a little disjointed, haven't had my quota of coffee.

Most of the students in Texas schools are minorities and yet it is whites that fought to keep funding. Minorities and young people just don't vote like we gray hairs do. And gray hairs have gotten their kids out of school and are less interested in raising taxes. But parents have got to support their schools and insist that their children adhere to some basic rules of respect for each other and for teachers. Testing is also a joke since billions are spent on tests that don't really show progress but only whether a kid can bubble between the lines. In Houston about half of all students drop out of school before graduation and of those that graduate 70% will have to take remedial courses in college before they can get into college classes. And why do we take off during summer and let out of school at 3pm? If we want to be competitive in world markets as well as have a pop that has a good standard of living we have to have a well educated pop.

As far as athletics are concerned,in many cases they are what give schools a sense of togetherness. But again in many Houston schools, because of the requirement to make grades to participate in extra-cirric activities many sports teams barely have enough people to field a team.

So, parent participation, being willing to vote for what you want, demanding that our children adhere to basic respectful attitudes, change the testing regiman, and make the school longer will make the system better. And oh yes, guys like me need to mentor young men who do not have a man in the house. It's very difficult for women to be both father and mother to young males. And if you're a male and hot for some sweety, remember what my old coach used to tell us, "if you can't use a rubber, keep your peter in your pants". also, if you father a child be a father, not some drone hoovering around the females for honey.

Where there are engaged parents who support teachers, administrations, and their own children you don't have the problems we have mentioned.

Minority kids are as smart as white kids. They've got to see that by not becoming education they will end up living a dismal existence.

As you can see it's a complex problem, but one that if we all realize that education is the most important thing in our society and that our success as individuals and as a nation is directly related to educational success, we can turn things around.

BBJBS-- Keep your interest in politics and organizing. But at the same time get as much education as you can to be an effective advocate for change. And if your parent/s don't seem to care one way or another about you being educated, then you have to be your own parent and more smart choices. It's not enough to just say that the system is "fucked up".

Actually, my parents DO care about my brother and I's education, very much so. The problem is, the government doesn't generally give a shit about education. You want proof? The No Child Left Behind Act, passed by George W. Bush. This act cuts funding to schools with lower scores on standardized testing, which actually makes NO FUCKING SENSE. The schools with lower scores are the ones who obviously need more funding and yet the federal government cuts it. Obama's race to the top seems similar.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/03/30-12

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/07/25-4

The government doesn't give a shit about education and by extension, the youth of America, our future, and the future of the country as a whole. Kids would do a much better job of running things. If the politicians had to live in the hellhole future that they're abandoning my generation to, they might do something differently.

Man, quit your dramatic bullshit. Education is no worse off today than it's ever been in the US. But ZOMG America is going to die because Bush/Obama/states didn't/aren't wasting more money on education in the middle of a recession and multiple wars!!!!!

Got an idea. Go get a credit card or two, start buying everything you want to make your own perfect little world, and wait a couple months to learn an important lesson about spending and debt.

Or go read up on Greece, Portugal, and Italy.

The idea that giving more money to failing schools would make the schools successful is not founded in fact. The above examples of private schools that take in less money per student than public schools, and yet perform better proves that.
As has been said several times in this discussion, performance in school has many factors, and only a few of them are things that the school itself can change. Community support, parental involvement, and a child's willingness to be educated are all important factors in the success of a school. The per pupil funding does not affect these.
I realize it probably sounds like I am not supportive of your efforts, but I am. I'm good old fashioned FDR liberal. (Trust me, I have had more than one infuriating discussion with an R.) But we can't keep throwing more money at the problem, doing the same thing year after year, and expecting different results. I believe one of the biggest societal challenges we face in the coming decades is teaching the next generations that education is a valuable asset because so many of their parents never learned that.

OK, so now education, which is necessary for a healthy economy by creating more high-paying jobs, is now a waste. Let's not forget that the recession is caused by lowered taxes to millionares and billionares and corporate handouts, in addition to said wars. Iraq and Afghanistan are being fought because one has lots of oil and the other is an important crossroads in Afghanistan. Afghanistan has historically been an important trade route. Any questions? And Zen, I agree with you on some points, but some textbooks at my school saw the first Reagan election.

if taxes are too low then get parents and other voters in your school district to raise taxes. i agree with others on this thread that just throwing money at the problem is not enough. if parents in your district would get behind stricter behavior rules and older tax payers would get involved in volunteering the district would get better. NCLB is not andwill not be the answer. We've all got to pitch in to change the system.