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Wednesday, September 10, 2014 - 02:49 am  Looks like a bug was introduced that started on February 3393 on LU that is causing new contributions from the population and profits from investments to decrease the cash level of investment funds rather than increase it. All my countries appear to be affected and I checked other player countries that appear to be affected too. My countries on other worlds are not affected. Countries: Canndinnalm https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=w3graph&miTable=cntrhist&miKey=2023&miColumn=vCInvestmentsTotalFund CC2 https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=w3graph&miTable=cntrhist&miKey=2022&miColumn=vCInvestmentsTotalFund CC9 https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=w3graph&miTable=cntrhist&miKey=154&miColumn=vCInvestmentsTotalFund Dream Land https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=w3graph&miTable=cntrhist&miKey=1406&miColumn=vCInvestmentsTotalFund
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| Friday, September 12, 2014 - 01:53 am This is still an issue. My funds have trillions in damages now.
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| Friday, September 12, 2014 - 01:43 pm i sure hope they fix this, i've put allot of effort into that secret stash, IFs are one of my favorite parts of the game
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| Saturday, September 13, 2014 - 03:56 pm I'm getting whacked aswell, very odd. I'm sure the GM will fully reinstate our monies plus lost interest ASAP.
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| Sunday, September 14, 2014 - 03:42 am I noticed this is affecting my country Victory at Yorktown on FB now. This is a major issue. Like others on this thread, I have worked to get my IFs where they are. I have purposely forgone cash and profits for my countries and enterprises to get these funds going. It is now affecting my game play, as I am delaying managing my funds until this is resolved. Can we get a comment on this?
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| Wednesday, September 17, 2014 - 01:34 pm bumping
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| Thursday, September 18, 2014 - 10:51 am yeah, losing about 1T every 4-5 days from each Investment Fund...
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| Friday, September 19, 2014 - 04:11 am correction 100B every 4-5 days, still, not very impressed. I noticed some other people's accounts are still increasing from large employee comtributions and v.low interest payments, so I am guessing it is the interest payments that is being deducted.
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| Friday, September 19, 2014 - 10:23 pm i'm trying to remain optimistic, but its getting difficult, watching these investments just disappear, thats allot of cash that i coulda used for something else, given that its based on real world interest, it'd take over 20 years of playing simcountry to make a profit, this stash of cash was a large part of my long term sim-plans, i hope this gets fixed
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| Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 03:39 am ,,,,did this occur during a foreign sick on a count of a bird, micro, soap, while a Large Stadium Met Empty, over Sat, Heavy Set, During a Squeeze Play or Auto set, an Eastward or Westward movement of a Tycoon, was the money earmarked for disposal bin, a first or a not your first Investment, had you worked with a v an an e in your account? were their traces of oil left on your subsquent grocery purchase, we mae be able too help!
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| Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 03:13 pm GM must be on Holiday... When was the last time he posted on the forum?
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| Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 10:48 pm lol, movement! its alive, in a sly goading sort off way. I really would prefer a fix to the problem mentioned in this thread rather than a rearrangement of the private investment webpage layout...
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 12:20 am Step for word Claude if Buy no clears, Deb in tears your habit at purse sent tile an if Buy noc clear ... *2 1 1 i Len did Margin he's here , Thanks Toody well, Claude, Buy not Clear. on yer way up claude on the Market pause sechuan too talk too is Allah Timor ease friend of Flate's, Flate, can help you, but seize only wen ices, you con sieze him , now but ad lure a fraid o you lol
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 11:54 am The investment funds, to date, did not have any significant role in Simcountry. The only contribution was a small increase in the income of workers that came from the profits of these funds. They also used the money to buy shares, but the countries did not have any control on these funds, their income or their spending. We have looked into this in the past, and said that in time, the funds will be corrected, some errors will be fixed and we hope to give them a more significant role in the future. The role of the funds is now absolutely insignificant. Some corrections that have been made, may kick in and start moving these funds into a more realistic value that is not inflated by historic numbers when 1T was 0.25 gold coins. When all of this is done, we may introduce new game features that will make the funds important and more fun.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 01:55 pm Andy. You asked me to keep it short in another thread. Do I need to explain or will you believe me when I say that this issue is game-breaking.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 04:48 pm Wow, I actually impressed with Andy's straightforwardness, since he's back. I need to go on that vacation. Aries, Andy is correct, the investment funds are insignificant. Being based a crappy stock market hasn't helped either. I hope this talk of doing something with that feature isn't vaporware. Keep up the good work, Andy.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 04:58 pm Game breaking? Please explain. I would like to understand this. also check the game news from yesterday. I am sure you will discover that when opinions are constructive and well explained, things happen. more underway.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 05:13 pm I am at work and a longer explanation will come when I get home and have more than my phone. Consider, that it appears the dividend income of all funds is not only lost but is negative. This effects the global economy in general but specifically players who have managed their funds. My funds likely own some 25-30% of the total value of corps in my empire. That proportion of profits is not lost from some olden value of gold coins. That value is lost, and turned negative, today. Note. My entire account is less than two years old. My funds are all the result of work and planning.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 05:18 pm Looking forward to the explanation. In the mean time: The dividends from shares you have in any corporation are paid to you, independent of the fund, or its value. The dividends the fund receives from its share holdings, are added to the fund, not to your country income. there is no connection between fund income and country income.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 05:30 pm I am floored that this is not recognized as a problem. These are my funds. I understand where their cash goes and how they work. With this known, I have spent a lot of time on them. For me, this would be no different than if the next war update took all my weapons or the next country update took all my cash.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 09:20 pm Longer Explanation. 1. Aren't these funds "ours" Up until this sudden change, we assumed these were our funds for our countries. How could we possibly assume otherwise? They are ours to manage. There is a setting that states "Buy and Sell shares for your investment fund automatically.". My fund. right? 2. I thought this was a part of the game I could play and advance in. Well, isn't it? How serious did I take this? I have a document on my computer that tracks my funds. I can tell you the value of the funds separated into cash and shares for all 9 of my LU countries and a total amount for the last three times I counted them. I have spent dozens of hours managing them. I don't think I am unique in this Andy but these funds were seriously in the "one more thing I can do category". What I mean is they were what kept the game interesting for me. I hit war level 11 and game level 15. I crushed every PVP opponent I have faced. This is what I do now along with teaching other players the game which I do generously. Can I not do this? You said "The role of the funds is now absolutely insignificant." Don't we have a say in this? 3. I think you underestimate our attachment If you value my funds so lightly, I want to buy them with account cash (even though I thought they were mine already). You said 1 Trillion for .25 coins. So my funds were worth about $440 Trillion at last count (stocks and cash) so 440 * .25 = 110 coins. Don't see game money for sale but enterprise says current exchange is $36B/coin so 110 * .036 = $3.96 Trillion. I will pay double that. Triple? How about $100 Trillion? All I ask is that my funds work the way they were working already. The implementation of this sudden change is an attack on trust. The appeal of this game is that you have an opportunity to build things and have your time rewarded. I am willing to risk my things in war but taking away my funds by implying they were not mine to begin with and assuming they magically made themselves valuable without my effort is wrong.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 09:59 pm my main argument, is these funds largely were not powered by sim-pop contributions, but corp profits, profits that could have been redirected some where else. in the month prior to this, i adjusted country settings in 4 countries, to up the dividend pay-in in my main country to the 55-60B/GM range, i'd increased my IF by about 12-15T, then bam! its all gone, 12-15T that i coulda used for upgrades, or products i sell in space. now its just gone IF, for your average player, are insignificant, this is true, how ever, when one learns how, with skill and patience, an IF, as it stands now, can do some interesting things in a country. although, before i come to a conclusion on this matter, i'd like to hear what changes the GM are planning, it might be worth the loss of 100T, if that means the feature is made cooler. so Andy, i'll tell you, WC3, has handled this true to form, you've blind sided long term players, dimishing long term asset stashes, with the promise of newer, cooler features. how about giving us more details, including what will change, and what you need to see changed before you can do that? how long will this take? as it is, you've just told us that we don't deserve a stash of cash we've spent years building, while hinting at features, which you have a high tendency to string out for years, if you ever get around to it at all!
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 10:11 pm Andy, These investment funds are hard earned monies that i have spent considerable time building. They are a store of wealth that can be extracted using a corporation and stock sales so to say that they are insignificant simply is not true. why will you not acknowledge that the game mechanic regarding the investment funds is broken? why is the money in my investment fund disappearing?
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 10:18 pm to reference what Aries said, my account, is 4-6 months younger than his, the size of my IFs, isn't a matter of what the GC conversion used to be, but what i choose to put into them! game cash, that frankly, is just being taken from me, because you believe i don't deserve it.
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| Wednesday, September 24, 2014 - 11:10 pm The part of the investment fund that is being restructured is the cash part, largely originating from contributions by the population, less the amounts paid to workers and the major contributions, coming from interest. Interest should be set to zero or lower as it does not come from any investment made by the fund but it is paid by the gamemaster. There is no reason for the GM to do this. Also, most of the cash originates from the time money was worthless. You can escape all these changes of course, by purchasing shares and investing all the cash. this is not happening in most countries. Most of the assets are cash. having huge funds cash in all countries makes them worthless and insignificant. Everybody is rich but cannot use the money for anything at all that can make any difference in the country. There is no way to mix these funds with the country cash, it was never the case. The profit of the fund should come from investments, cash should be reduced and interest rates even negative, to make sure presidents are investing the cash. Nobody lost any 40T here. and no fund should have 40T in the first place. The fund will either remain insignificant, and side tracked as it was until now or it can be restructured and get a real part to play. Currently, there are other, more urgent issues and we do not plan any significant change in the role of the funds. We will zero the interest paid by the gamemaster. we will discuss the possibility of a negative interest rate or leave it at zero. we will also look into the contributions to the funds and the use of the funds as an extra income to the workers which was always a small amount. All these amounts, adding and subtracting is quite confusing to most players, have zero influence on the economies of the countries and are in fact unnecessary complexities in the game. The only good thing to do with this money is to purchase shares. This will of course remain as it always has been. more incentives to do so can help.
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 12:20 am "The part of the investment fund that is being restructured is the cash part, largely originating from contributions by the population, less the amounts paid to workers and the major contributions, coming from interest." or 1. "The part of the investment fund that is being restructured is the cash part....coming from interest" If you mean to say the dividends now have a negative effect on the cash level of the fund, this is correct. 2. " largely originating from contributions by the population" This is not true for those that work on their funds. Dividends account for 2 or 3 times the amount added to the cash level of the funds compared to worker contributions for most of my funds. 3. "Interest should be set to zero or lower as it does not come from any investment made by the fund but it is paid by the gamemaster. " Interest should be paid by the magical World Bank at rates somewhat lower than it itself loans out. Would it not make sense that this is the source of the funds the World Bank has available to loan out rather than some non-game generated source? 4. "Also, most of the cash originates from the time money was worthless. " Can you define this time period. My account is from 12-2012. When was money worthless? Is it worthless now? 5. "There is no way to mix these funds with the country cash, it was never the case. " How simple do we want to make this game? Of course I have ways to influence a balance of country funds and investment funds. I choose when and at what value to IPO corps. I choose tax rates and profit sharing. I can sell shares from different countries and enterprises to funds at any time at prices high or low. I made choices to grow my funds before any GM declared that fund's cash was worthless. 6. "Nobody lost any 40T here. and no fund should have 40T in the first place. " How about some notice? I would have made different decisions. Anything else I should know coming that might effect game-play? At least with weapons and ammo, I got some notice before gradual decreases in their value. If I paid $15 million each for weapons that now cost $10 million, would you say I lost $5 million/weapon? Again, This change had the benefit of notice and being a gradual change. I changed my game-play to compensate and did not feel blindsided. The change to funds had neither of those things. 7. "We will zero the interest paid by the gamemaster. " Good. Take away the free money the "World Bank" has to lend and have it pay the interest to the funds for the rights to lend their cash. 8. "All these amounts, adding and subtracting is quite confusing to most players" Welfare index, running corps, and taking a level 2 C3 is confusing to most players. It's a good thing some experienced players are interested in growing the game and spend their time helping these players. Your welcome. 9. "The fund will either remain insignificant, and side tracked as it was until now or it can be restructured and get a real part to play. " Side track it has my vote over this. Go ahead and take my side track vote to any other change that takes my stuff without notice. 10. "The only good thing to do with this money is to purchase shares. This will of course remain as it always has been. more incentives to do so can help" So, the funds buy shares, they earn dividends which are then deducted from the available cash of the funds. How long can that last? This is the global effect that I was referring to earlier. Alright back to this one "Nobody lost any 40T here. and no fund should have 40T in the first place." Maybe I should ask what I should have because this did not seem unusual to me. My main had $56.68 Trillion in cash alone the last time I counted and my funds on LU totaled $214.39 Trillion in cash from a total of $442.22 Trillion in value. I just counted $655 Trillion in country and enterprise cash/loans right now. Should I have that? I have $715 Trillion in military assets counted from the finance pages. This is before quality so, conservatively, it comes to some $2000 Trillion+ after quality. Should I have that? Please tell me what I should have and what I should do with the rest. Thank you -------------------------------------------- Now for a better idea. Why don't you consider providing an option to allow players to spend their built up funds for a real benefit? The premise is these funds don't do anything. Allow the players who want to keep their worthless funds to do so with the way things work now and allow other players to trade in their funds to purchase things, whether it is some conversion to gold coins, game money, population, or whatever. Be creative. This allows the GM to estimate his value of removing these funds from the game world versus the player's own valuation of those funds. The store could be a limited time option before some detailed, community-discussed, announced well-ahead of time, awesome, new features in the future. Just, until then, at least, give me the option to keep my funds, my cash, and the dividends that I worked and planned for.
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Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 01:46 pm
i get the hint, i'll stop talking before you take away my birthday
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 04:20 pm The statements above are largely incorrect. There are some changes expected in these funds: 1. The world bank is not interested in the money. It takes loans when it needs them but the funds money is not part of it. There is no reason to pay any interest on this money and inject useless (or any other) money into the game and distort the cash flow. 2. The contribution of the population are too high. More should be spent on products, and less given to the funds. They are swamped in huge unused amounts. This is money that is taken out of the world cash into the funds. 3. The contributions of the funds to the people who have paid their money in the past, are far too small. These amounts will increase. 4. Funds will receive less from the populations, and pay back more. They have income from dividend and can increase their income, by making sure their money is invested in shares. Money sitting in the fund will not earn anything. Money put in the stock market may earn dividend or increase/decrease in value. 5. Some funds will remain cash positive, earning more than they are paying. Some may pay out more than their income. we might later add some level of choice for the fund to raise or reduce such payments. 6. Funds that are becoming cash negative, will sell some of their share holdings, or reduce their payments to the workers. 7. The page explaining the funds will be improved and will show all the data that is relevant to the fund. The changes that are needed to implement all this will start kicking in in the coming weeks. The separation between the money of the state and the fund remains as it was. Added income as a result of larger payments to the workers is not a major benefit to the country but rather a boost for the world market. Plans to create a closer relation between the funds and countries, possible financial support by the fund to a failing economy etc. will remain on our wish list but are deferred to a later point in time.
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 10:02 pm Andy, you have taken money from our investment fund cash fund. I do not agree with you that most of this cash was generated when "cash was worthless', I worked hard to generate this money. I understand your rational for doing this, however some warning would have been polite to your customers before you start taking cash from their investment fund.
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 10:41 pm I still don't understand what benefit you got from that fund. It was basically a monetary black hole, that ate cash and never gave it back. Everything Andy has said about it tracks with what I was aware of, so it didn't change while I was gone. Also, very little of what you guys have said makes any sense. Either you guys didn't understand what you were doing, which I don't beleive, or you had some other nefarious thing going on that you don't want to talk about. I mean I can beleive that one of you got all bored one day and started playing the stock market. But there is no way all of you were, unless you were getting something out of it. Quite few things that have been said even directly imply you were benefitting somehow. Your not going to have any sympathy as long as your evasive about it. This was a simple improvement to the game, you had to know whatever you were doing would be subject to game improvements. But you can't expect W3C to not break something they weren't aware of.
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 11:19 pm interesting isn't it, hymy? that made me chuckle, in one breath Andy said the IFs where useless, then in the next explained why large IFs are valuable, and you missed it anyways, in reference to my ever decreasing IF, whats the target goal cash level for these funds, andy? that is, how low do that have to go, before they stop decreasing?
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| Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 11:59 pm also andy, i see where your going with this, i think it sounds like the pay out to the pop, will be based on dividends, instead of that increasing the fund. the fund will increase based on pop contributions. un-invested money, will have a zero, or a negative effect. if i've got this right(?) this is a positive change i'm still disappointed from my lump of cash just being deleted, but your change sounds very good, i can already think how this will be much more beneficial, various settings i can change to manipulate this to a greater advantage than my 90T coulda done
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 04:23 am @hymy It is possible to extract money from the investment fund by buying shares from your CEO company. Meanwhile the cash was earning some interest. Long term investment and a store of wealth. but anyway...
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 04:28 am My gripe is that we were not given sufficient warning or time to allocate our cash before it started to be stripped from us. And no mention of compensation.
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 10:49 am The fund was set up to make sure some money goes into the share market. Investment funds trade automatically according to some rules and make sure we have an active share market. without the funds, the share market would not work as the number of manual transactions is too small. The error in the procedure is that money came in, for a long time, and ended up sitting there as unused cash. Money going out was a tiny fraction of the income. Except for this, funds are a marginal function and for now will remain so although we will try to move them from irrelevance, to something with more common sense. To discard false claims, it should be clear that nobody earned any substantial amounts of money in the fund. It varies from zero in most cases, to a small percentage in other cases. Certainly the president did little to get money into the fund. If anyone, these are workers who put some of their salaries in the fund instead of buying new cars for themselves. Most of the money came from the gamemaster. The upcoming change will end the gamemaster funding. It will also end the endless taking of money from the workers while giving them nearly nothing in return, and using the money to build a fund that does not do what it should. The fund should give more money back to the investors. The cash is not going away and there is no need to warn you months in advance. The fund will keep the cash but to make a profit, it will have to invest the cash in shares. Funds do not need to make money from the gamemaster while sitting on their hands. Making money with the funds will depend on the capabilities of the president to make money in the stock market. A good fund will pay more to the workers in the country. This remains a marginal advantage as the money is not necessarily being used by the workers, in the country itself. We might add an index that is related to the profitability of the fund. We will not have a negative interest rate yet. If funds will not invest, we will need a more powerful tool to make them either invest or the money will dissolve slowly with a negative interest rate. Cash in funds may also decline as a result of larger payments to the workers in the country. I assume everyone will love the workers to have more money. We just need to make sure this will not create large shortages on the markets as the money will be used to purchase products. Income from taxes will not be influenced as the fund pays net amounts.
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 01:41 pm 'Certainly the president did little to get money into the fund. ' wrong
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 01:43 pm 'it should be clear that nobody earned any substantial amounts of money in the fund. It varies from zero in most cases, to a small percentage in other cases. ' is not consistent with 'Most of the money came from the gamemaster. '
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 01:44 pm 'The cash is not going away and there is no need to warn you months in advance.' wrong look at my investment funds, losing cash monthly.
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 01:48 pm Andy Can you answer my previous question many post ago, why is the money in my investment fund disappearing?
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 07:14 pm Thannks claude, for being clear about that.
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 09:23 pm The funds might loose much more money as we move on. They will have to pay their investors serious money. Funds that will not invest, will make losses. Start putting the money to work ASAP.
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| Friday, September 26, 2014 - 10:39 pm Andy, It is very disappointing to see you treating us this way. While I understand your intentions, for me it is a matter of principle. Your actions show me little respect for the time and money I have invested in the game. Don't expect my support any longer.
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| Saturday, September 27, 2014 - 11:45 am No problem. We will make the investment fund an active part of the game. I fail to see where a president has any value attached to the fund. you can do nothing at all with the money in the fund. It was never yours and unusable for the president. It has always been this way. Now, after this change, much more money will flow from the fund to the citizens of the country. This must sound like a real disaster and misuse of "well earned funds". If you want to sit on the unusable money gained from GM "interest" and gain more unusable money without doing anything, this is the wrong game for you. Reread my explanation. I fail to see how anyone could think that this is a bad feature for the game. Not a very important one but in any case, not damaging anyone.
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| Saturday, September 27, 2014 - 12:22 pm I am not arguing that the reforms aren't good Andy. It is about time. It is your failure to understand that taking money from an account that I worked to build without any warning is quite offensive. At first I thought it was a game error. Such time has passed that large quantities of cash have been taken from my accounts. Now you tell us to use it or lose it. I am a little busy at the moment and don't really have the time to deal with you forcing my hand. Your failure to 'see where a president has any value attached to the fund' is the problem here. You are taking money from me that I worked hard to generate. What is so hard to understand about that? I can access investment fund cash by IPO'ing my CEO owned companies, selling 80% of them to my investment funds and in doing so raising the individual corp to a Q250 productivity and efficiency and extracting money from the investment fund to my CEO account. Most often I would buy undervalued shares from you (the gamemaster CEO account). The money in the fund is mine because I sold shares that I bought for a pittance into my investment fund and managed these corps with my CEO, built the companies up, and sold them for a huge profit for my investment fund. There is no disaster or misuse here except your blindness to my point of view. The pissy little amount of GM 'interest' equates to a pretty minor part of the 170T I had amassed in one of my funds. And so what if it is just sitting there. It is not like I am spending my whole day playing this game striving to employ all my resources at every moment. I had alway thought of this a long term game.
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| Saturday, September 27, 2014 - 03:48 pm when you say it was never our funds, thats kinda a loose way to justify taking them, i can adjust my tax rates, to increase the profit pay outs into my IFs, rather than into my countries general fund, its a diversion of money that i choose to make, it is my money, money i choose to put into the IFs, rather than into my direct trading
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| Saturday, September 27, 2014 - 04:49 pm I agree with the last few posts here. I run 0% tax in 6 of my 9 countries on LU to pay additional dividends to my funds. This unannounced change that was not addressed on this thread for two weeks changes my game-play. I still don't know exactly where my funds cash is going. Is this going to citizens? It does not appear so.
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| Sunday, September 28, 2014 - 05:45 pm Orbiter, you cannot influence the payments into the fund. They are part of the income of workers, depending on which group it is. We are not taking any of your money away, the money away, the money from the fund, is paid to the workers. it will become visible in the coming days, on the page describing the fund.
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| Sunday, September 28, 2014 - 05:46 pm Great to have some animated discussion on the forum. The GMs love it. This one is about nothing, but who cares?
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| Sunday, September 28, 2014 - 11:44 pm Andy, lol, By raising wages you can increase payments into the fund, Unless you have recently changed this. How can 200B per game month be paid to workers? Yes, Andy 200B per game month from each fund. Can you read this? Can you look at my game account and check? It would have to be a very well invested funded to withstand that kind of payout.
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 12:07 am Ah, Now you are showing some numbers and reason. 200B is unreasonable. raising salaries? the last reason for that is income for the fund. and the influence of the salaries is small. Other results of higher salaries are much more significant. to really increase input to the fund, you need to increase salaries to unreasonable levels. your corporations will die. and for what? as I said, the money is not yours. you cannot mix it with the country funds. when the change is made this week, the numbers will make sense. We will have to set it to some initial percentage and then look at results in many countries and tune it in the first days it runs. by the end of the coming week, I hope to have it all done.
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 12:18 am but i can andy, in the countries at the top of this page, that Aries referenced, "Dream Land," is mine, it holds about 19T worth of corporation stocks, all of which are state corps in 6 of my other countries, in those countries, i can run a high tax to put the corp profits into my countries general fund, or i can run low tax, to put the money into Dream's Investment Fund, can absolutely effect the pay-in, or at least for the seven years i've played this game, i could. my current account was started shortly after the cash to gold converstion was taken way, not that long ago, in sim country terms. i deleted my old stuff, and started fresh, like claude said, i originally raised my salaries to high level, 500, i also had some shuttle corps that i ran with even higher salaries, that accounted for half my pops contributions, when i built up enough funds to invest in my slaves's corps, between raising taxes to keep my countries in the black, then lowering taxes to fatten my investment funds, i managed to save up over 90T, over 100T including the stock value, thats game cash that could be in my direct trading, at this moment, but i choose to put it into my IFs i'm behind your new ideas, but you guys have handled this in about the worst way you could!
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 12:30 am "I can run a high tax to put the corp profits into my countries general fund" The taxes are paid to the country where the corporation resides, not to any fund. dividends are paid to the share holders if the corporation is public. the fund does have dividend income. great. then what? can you buy weapons with the money? or products and put them in stock in the country? can you restock your corporations by use of this money, or build facilities in the country? no. none of the above. You can purchase stock in many more corporations. this is indeed what it is intended for. but a lot of it has to be paid back to the investors. this was close to zero and will now be corrected.
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Monday, September 29, 2014 - 12:41 am
and if the share holder is an investment fund, the profits are payed to it
thats the point, this was money that i could have done those things with, but i choose to boost my IFs i understand where your going with this, i'm behind that, but you've handled this all wrong, prior to this, it would take away profits that you could use for other reasons, and just pile up, now these piles of cash are being removed, with out warning, or even a word about it until 2 weeks in. as it is, i'm waiting for the first of next month to make adjustments and buy more shares for my IFs, had i known a month ago, that 2 weeks later my funds would disappear, i'd have had the option to do something different, instead, it took 2 weeks for you to even say anything about it, further, you deny that players are able to manipulate these funds, to justify doing anything you want to them, and that just isn't true
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 12:45 am and about the tax, yes, the tax goes into the country, not the share holders, but the profit after tax goes to the share holders, so if my IFs are the share holders, i can adjust my tax to direct the same corp profits to the country general fund, or to my IFs
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 10:25 am in addition to this overall change, i'd ask that you consider an adjustment to the PE ratio as it is, if the pop will be payed the dividends, then the IFs should target corps that pay out, as it is, they go for PE rates that are good, based on net profit, how ever, net profit is higher when dividends are not payed, giving corps that don't pay out a better PE, and higher market value for our home viewers that may not get it. the share price of a corporation, is the market value, divided by the total number of shares, as demand for shares increase, the price goes up, increasing the market value. the auto-buy/sell feature for IFs, mostly targets PE ratios of 40 or lower (better,) meaning corps will float around the 40 PE range, PE is a ratio of the profit to price, if the relative profit is higher than the price, you'll have a lower, better PE. investors will buy in, the price will increase, raising (worsening,) the PE ratio, until it gets high enough to sour investors if net profit is high, it will mean the IFs will buy at a higher price, but profit sharing is subtracted from net price, meaning corps that pay out dividends, will sell at a lower price, while the IFs care nothing about the pay out, only the PE with these planned changes, IFs should focus more on corps that pay out dividends, rather than hold the money to inflate the value
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| Monday, September 29, 2014 - 10:14 pm Orbiter, correct me if I am wrong, but don't all Public Corporations pay out a dividend if they exceed about 200 billion SC$?
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| Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - 10:11 pm not sure, i've never been patient enough to wait, and pay close enough attention to who actually gets the money
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| Wednesday, October 1, 2014 - 05:14 pm Profit transfer is a percentage of the profit that goes to the owner. In a private corporations, there is one share holder. He received the part of the profit. In a public corporation, that percentage that is specified under shared profit, is paid to the share holders as a dividend. depending on the number of shares they have, they receive an amount. if 50%, the dividend is 50% of the profit. divide the profit by the number of shares outstanding, multiply by the number of shares you have and you receive 50% of the result. this is how it is done in the real world. the company decides on a dividend per share. here we decide on a percentage of the profit. divide it by the number of shares and we have the dividend per share.
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| Friday, October 3, 2014 - 03:06 pm After several updates to the investment part, it is now closer to where it should be. Larger amounts are now paid back to the investors. More will be don to manage potential shortage of cash, sale of assets to increase cash if needed and the management of the investment funds in C3 countries. We hope that in time, funds will be able to invest mort in the share market and that we will end up with a large portion of the fund assets invested, instead of sitting in a large pool of cash.
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