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Monday, May 23, 2011 - 03:31 pm  With my enterprise I was able to purchase a space shuttle company. I have this company for about two normal weeks now and I do not see any production at all. I do see that the assets are going up until 14-16 months and after that it drops back to zero. Probably I'm doing something wrong here, could someone guide me into the right direction to fix this problem?
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| Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 05:31 am Actually over the weekend my space shuttle company reduced it's level of production and has not produced a space shuttle since last week on Thursday. I am most likely shutting it down in the morning. I only received one response to my post letting me know it produces slowly. I have had it since February. I am aware of it's production rate, currently it does not have one. I believe it is bugged and apparently game masters do not wish to a dress this issue for some reason. Anyone want to buy it from me? Maybe I'm just doing it wrong.
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| Thursday, May 26, 2011 - 08:36 am U will probably find the space shuttles when u look for them in your countries space station and view cargo shuttles
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| Friday, May 27, 2011 - 06:17 am nope. Cause I generally sell them for coin when they were being produced and had stored 26 in my enterprise which I transfered back to my country and sold for coin. For awhile no one was buying them. My cargo shuttle company does not seem to produce anything anymore, maybe my workers are on strike. They could have their own union I suppose. I was reading my newspapers looking for strike information on their union. But I don't see their acronym mentioned anywhere. I believe they are organized as the Builders International Group of Absent Space Shuttles.
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| Friday, May 27, 2011 - 11:51 am Are there corporation links to check these?
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| Saturday, May 28, 2011 - 05:18 am Jokes about unions aside. I shut down my cargo shuttle company. It went a week without producing anything but accumulating loans. It was definitely bugged but, oh well on to other things. Why run a company whose only purpose seems to be to accumulate loans
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| Saturday, May 28, 2011 - 05:21 am Oh and that was an actual week. 28 game months
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| Saturday, May 28, 2011 - 07:15 am did you buy shuttle fuselage for it? those are *not* purchased automatically, you have to either set up a contract or buy them with your country/enterprise then sell them to the shuttle corporation.
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| Saturday, May 28, 2011 - 11:42 am when I shut it down I had 3 shuttle fuselages in stock. No one seems to get the fact that I had this corporation for months (real months not game months) it produced lots of shuttles. Then it stopped producing. In a weeks time I paid off 350 billion dollars worth of loans for it, because all it would do is take out loans. I would also feed about 50 billion dollars into it each morning before work in the hope that it wouldn't take out any loans that day. This wasn't some company I set up and then shut down a week later.
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| Sunday, May 29, 2011 - 07:44 am No, no one is assuming anything really. Actually, the same sort of thing happened with a Cargo Shuttle corporation on Golden Rainbow a while ago and..yes, it was closed also. It was supposed to produce like 1 Cargo Shuttle every X world months (around 30), and it sat there for a really long time and produced maybe 1 at the start, then nothing ever more. So, at least from here, just wanted to see the corporation links to take a look at what was going on. And, yes, it is believed that likely there was some 'bug', because it's not -just- Cargo Shuttles that do this, but all corporations that produce less than 1 product per world month; no, not saying "all", just, in general, those corporation types tend to have various 'bug' problems with not producing as much as they should. Examples would include military bases and airports, naval ships, some facilities (Airports, Hospitals, Universities), etc...but, it seems to happen more when hiring is less than 100%, and however the internal program is calculating or storing partial yields, gets thrown off...as CraftyCockney said, like for many other problems, it could be some kind of "rounding error", too.
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| Sunday, May 29, 2011 - 03:28 pm We just explained these cargo shuttle corporations in the game news. Corporations producing less than one product in a game year are frequently very profitable and they work just fine if the have the cash they need to finance their operations including salaries and large quantities of raw materials while nothing is sold. Once a product is ready, they sell it for a lot of money and produce a profit. if raw materials or workers are not fully available, the production process might be prolonged even further or stop altogether. It is just a little more complicated.
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| Monday, June 6, 2011 - 02:45 pm uhm, ok, well now I have a spacecraft maintenance units company that shows it has 42 products offered but not sold on the world market, but you can"t sell those on the world market? can I have my 42 products back, cause it will not let me retract the offer. Oh and I bought another cargo shuttle company, but will probably shut it down because in over a real life week it has not produced anything.
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| Sunday, June 12, 2011 - 10:46 pm Have a Cargo Shuttle corporation on Little Upsilon now. Will report how it does. So far it had a shortage of Shuttle Fuselages, which caused a 'shortage'. You must manually buy those and sell them to the corporation, it seems, or have them bought via contract. If you don't do that, production may stop. One error message was reported when selling supplies to the corporation: "Your credit limit of 180B SC$ has been reached for this month." Apparently, you can only sell up to that amount per world month to the corporation. That allowed only 7 Shuttle Fuselages to be sold to the corporation at one time. Also, there is another error message: " Transferred 158.66B SC$ to 1 corporation. For some corporations it was not necessary to increase their (net) cash above 60.00B SC$." The corporation already had some negative cash levels of about 300B SC$ after the sales and a few world months of production with no sales. More cash was needed to send to the corporation, but this error only allowed up to 60B SC$ to be kept, with no debt, in the corporation. But, that amount is too small, and does not even cover the costs of one world month production without incurring negative cash and guaranteed auto-loans thereafter. This limit needs to be changed immediately, otherwise these corporations will continue to see high debt accummulation during the long production process, and that is already seen with most of those corporations. The recommended cash amount for such corporation is 1T SC$, so at least that amount should be allowed to transfer there. Corporation link, "Newark Cargo Shuttles" on Little Upsilon https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=ccorp&miCorpNumber=599403
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| Sunday, June 12, 2011 - 11:23 pm Newark Cargo Shuttles
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| Friday, June 17, 2011 - 02:51 pm reference: "Cattle Inc Daily Telegraph, Apr 29, 2803 Enterprise News Corporation Closed Thu Apr 2, 2803 The corporation Newark Cargo Shuttles in Cattle Inc has been closed because the debt is too high. 229050 employees were fired." Those corporations are not allowing enough SC$ cash to be --transferred IN-- and thus it took on debts and closed automatically after selling some supplies to it totallng about 160B SC$ or so. These corporations are --bugged-- and should NOT be built. If you don't believe it, go ahead and watch yours 'auto-close', too, or sit there with '0% production' like most all of the rest. Avoid these at all costs, unless you really have not much better to do ;).
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| Friday, June 17, 2011 - 03:47 pm There are 2 issues with cargo shuttles. The cash allowed to be tranfered in, as CP states is too low. It needs to be increased. Also the gold coin price for selling shuttles should be dictated by the seller and not restricted to 3.31 coins. Why should i only be allowed to sell a shuttle with 3000 missions for the same coins as someone with only 1000
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| Saturday, June 18, 2011 - 01:39 pm Why sell 300Q shuttles? Keep the high Q for yourself, make 100Q for market. Until its debugged... Does it work to contract these babies to yourself, I thought you can get partial payments on slow production items if contracted, and so the corp would get some income monthly? Or am I talking rubbish? Dunno.
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| Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 04:14 am Here's the "bought not delivered" problem also, reference: Direct Sale record: https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgiw?tbl "Transaction Request at Quality 100 Product When Quantity Quality Price Paid Strategy Price Cargo Shuttles from Indio Cargo Shuttles Feb 23 2804 1 cargo shuttle 158 741.81B SC$ Direct Sale 468.31B SC$" then, country Space Center record: https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgiw?spclist "Space Centers in Lextil Space Center Country Map Product Storage Shuttles CentauDos Dismantle? Boltar 58.36°S 63.88°W 950,730,592 units move products 0 view galaxy dismantle" That was 1 Cargo Shuttle sold on 'Direct Sale' from the corporation 'stock', paid for by the country at about 741B SC$, then no where to be found in the country 'Space Center Cargo Shuttles'. This is probably the 'bug' that some other leaders were complaining about before. Also, the 'new' Cargo Shuttle doesn't show on the 'browse Galaxy' list of Cargo Shuttles, nor the 'Direct Trade' list of available ones. Maybe there is a 'delay to update' and recognize the sale, etc., but, that's still like a 'bug', in that you bought something, you pay for it, and then it's not 'immediately delivered', as the 'Direct Sale' page clearly suggests it should be, as supposedly is done for every other product. reference: 'Direct Sale' page: https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgiw?tradedirectly " Sell directly to countries and enterprises Back to the World Trade page Setting up a direct sale between two parties works as follows: * use Messages to communicate with other party about a trading deal, * when you both agree on the terms for the deal, the offerer takes initiative by filling out a concept, * the buyer accepts the concept on this page and the deal is done." This 'deal' still isn't 'done'...
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| Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 04:21 am Crafty (Kebir Blue) Saturday, June 18, 2011 - 01:39 pm Click here to edit this post I thought you can get partial payments on slow production items if contracted, and so the corp would get some income monthly? ... It may have worked like that at one time...currently it does not. The corporation has several world months of losses (negative profit), then, if it makes it to the end before 'auto-closing', it can sell, if it actually sells, and get paid, if it actually gets paid, then, maybe get a positive, lump-sum payment at the end.
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| Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 05:28 pm Hmm, note I said 'contracted'. So we are assuming the product is sold already, just waiting for the order to be built. I think it used to work that way for hospitals and such, can't be sure now. Anyways, good luck with the space program...
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| Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 10:18 am OK, it appears there is a 'delay' after all for the Cargo Shuttle to be 'available': After doing a 2nd direct sale, between the same corporation and country, this message appeared in a blue box: https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgiw?gsvlist " You bought a Cargo Shuttle. Final assembly will take place at a Space Center soon." Also, now on the portal page for Direct Trade, the Cargo Shuttle increased by 1 (to 26 total here) though the actual Cargo Shuttle has not been added to the list yet, with just 25 listed there (that list will show if you click the 'sell Cargo Shuttles' link, see: Simcountry portal > Direct Trade > Buy or sell Cargo Shuttles > sell Cargo Shuttles) https://www.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgip?plogplay So, if you purchase --new-- Cargo Shuttles --from a corporation-- expect some delays before actually finding the item listed or available to use.
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| Wednesday, July 6, 2011 - 02:37 am When setting up a 'new corporation', the 'system' appears to take 1T SC$ cash from the country/enterprise (enterprise here) when a Cargo Shuttle corporation is requested to be built new (where it then appears on the 'pending deliveries' page), then it takes it --again-- when the corporation is actually built/placed in a country. That would be called 'double-charging' for the same service/product. Please carefully check this matter, as it has apparently already cost about 5-6T SC$ here. Thank you.
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| Wednesday, July 6, 2011 - 03:47 am Cargo Shuttle contracts, both done using 'auto-contract setup' and done manually from each corporation page, are --repeatedly auto-canceling--. This has been set up several times and the same result each time, regardless of the method used. Note: when setting up contracts, the 'product retained for contracts' is --not updating-- also. And, yes, the setting for that were all double-checked, re-set, contracts all re-done, and still the same problem. Basically, this is critical because if the products don't sell, the cash drops even further, causing more debts and closures. It's already happened here about 5-10 times. Enterprise link: https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=wel&miEID=PMQPMAGZBTZQ&miAID=PJAQFXVQKMJAAKXXKAKJ
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 02:01 am 3 more Cargo Shuttles closed. 10 [earth] hours ago they were totally fine, with 100B SC$ cash, supplies all fine, hiring ok, producing and ready to sell. Then mysteriously they all close, and, leave behind a bill of over 2T SC$! Cash from Closed Corporations -2,073.80B SC$ https://sim05.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=w3graph&miTable=enthist&miKey=9761&miColumn=vEcorpClosingCashTransfer Checked the graph for that, and that is from those 3 closing. There were no other recent closures. OK, what is likely happening is that the --auto-order-- function for Cargo Shuttle corporations is ordering --too much-- relative to the amount of --small cash-- available (maximum 100B SC$ cash now). When it orders, say 10-20 world months supplies of Shuttle Components, Shuttle Extensions, and Shuttle Engines (plus the Shuttle Boosters, Softwares, other supplies), what is happening is the total costs is skyrocketing into the 500B-1T SC$ range for buying supplies at one time. This causes massive debts, and immediately afterward, the corporations auto-close. This has happened 10 times now here, and compensation for all of the real problems, not "impressions", is requested. The real problems include: 1) double-charging to start the corporations new, valued at approximately 1T SC$ per corporation 2) corporations closing "for no reason", losing both a valuable corporation, all of the supplies it has, plus the product waiting to be sold (see below, regarding contracts) 3) contracting not functioning correctly, so sales need to be made using 1st: Direct Sale to a country with a Space Center, and whose spending space limit has not been used, which is a problem for high-quality Cargo Shuttles; then 2nd, sell to Direct Trade market, after a delay (see below) 4) delay to sell on Direct Trade market (the "8 hour delay" means even more time for debt accumulation in the corporations); then once sold, if sold, the Gold Coins need to be changed to SC$, if allowed by the system, or another "8-hour delay" occurs; then that cash needs to be sent via Direct Trade back to the country'enterprise, then sent back into the corporation(s)...again, limited to 100B SC$ inadequate level...and, the real problems repeat...
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 02:38 am 2 more just closed..this is all happening within minutes...the "world date" just went to the 11th, and apparently triggered more un-necessary 'auto-closures'. So make that 12 total now.
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 03:00 am For the ordering of supplies: 1) if done manually, this error occurs: " Your immediate order for ____________ has been executed. Unfortunately, there is not enough available on the market. The purchase order is listed with your other purchase orders and will be traded as soon as possible." 2) If using "auto", then what happens is the orders back-log, then all of a sudden in 1 or 2 world months, several orders all are bought --at the same time-- (ordered 4 world months ago, 6 world months ago, 8 world months, etc...) That supply shortage cause these huge 'spikes' in spending, which the corporation limited cash cannot cover, and then the corporation goes into massive debt and immediately closes. Not even the best "babysitter" can control that. 3) Contracting supplies is unrealistic for these corporations. There were forum posts explaining why and counting how many corporations and supplies were needed to do it. That advice was ignored as well. Maybe it's time to find a "babysitter" for "Gamemaster" instead.
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 06:03 am OK, now helping another leader make this space stuff work. Maybe it's going to take a 'village' to make space 'grow'. ;)
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 10:25 am With a new enterprise, started two new Cargo Shuttle corporations and it appears that the 'double-charge' has not occurred thus far. "Space Inc on KB" https://sim01.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgiw?efinance
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 12:36 pm OK, another problem to the list: New 'space' corporations start with --0-- supplies. Are you serious? Whoever is not getting the "impression" that there are problems with these corporations needs to either start reading more carefully, or try and actually make these work --themself-- because how is a corporation with --0 supplies-- ever considered not a problem?! This has happened now with about 10 Cargo Shuttle corporations, and now also with a Shuttle Components corporations. All have started with 0 supplies and doomed to 0% production as a result of "shortage of supplies". reference: https://sim01.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=ccorp&miCorpNumber=25441 https://sim01.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=ccorp&miCorpNumber=2868404 https://sim01.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=ccorp&miCorpNumber=2552196
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 01:33 pm New corporation, after manually going in an changing all supply orders, which were auto-started at 'best buy', resulted in 4 supplies not being delivered: reference: https://sim01.simcountry.com/cgi-bin/cgi2nova?SN_ADDRESS=wwwCountry&SN_METHOD=ccorptrade&miCorpNumber=2552196&miProduct=191&miQuantity=1034464&miTradeStrategy=6&miPricePerUnit=644.64&miIncrease=25&miStartDate=30331209&miActionReplace=1&miTransactionId=10 Requested Products - Waiting for Offers on the Market Product Amount in Units Requested Price Date Ordered Surplus Chemicals 253040 tons immediate December 18 3033 -3,777,114,253 details Electric Components 607268 units immediate December 18 3033 -2,235,723,945 details Electric Power 27046 million kwhs immediate December 18 3033 -142,119,694 details High Tech Services 1726470 units immediate December 18 3033 -3,006,136,788 details ... This is a serious problem, in fact, it has reached a 'crisis' state. Here are the --starting supplies-- then for a new Shuttle Components corporation: reference: Available Materials and Contracted Services Product Stock (Unit) Monthly Use Stock Months Avg. Quality Last Price Paid Market Price Chemicals 0 tons 50,000 - 100 0 SC$ 1,892 SC$ Electric Components 0 units 100,000 - 100 0 SC$ 906 SC$ Electric Power 0 million kwhs 1,500 - 100 0 SC$ 108,117 SC$ Electronic Components 492,029 units 100,000 4.9 108 1,638 SC$ 1,200 SC$ Factory Maintenance Units 10 units 3.00 3.3 100 4.37M SC$ 3.53M SC$ High Tech Services 0 units 75,000 - 100 0 SC$ 780 SC$ Industrial Equipment 1,871,484 units 150,000 12.5 101 1,439 SC$ 1,126 SC$ Machine Parts 952,800 units 140,000 6.8 108 1,641 SC$ 1,178 SC$ Household Products 746,346 tons 47,500 15.7 101 7,441 SC$ 5,761 SC$ Services 1,034,464 units 50,000 20.7 101 807 SC$ 679 SC$
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| Thursday, July 7, 2011 - 01:44 pm Whoever wrote this is completely wrong regarding 'space' corporations. reference: "Profit, Cash and Debt of Public Corporations Transferred 21.52B SC$ to 1 corporation. For some corporations it was not necessary to increase their (net) cash above 100.00B SC$." The 'Gamemaster' previously wrote, in the 'Game News' and other places, that Cargo Shuttle corporations should maintain 1T SC$ cash. How can on one hand the "error message" say "it [is] not necessary", then on the other say it is "recommended". That is called hypocrisy, and it is a problem. Whoever doesn't have the "impression" now that this needs to change is the one with the real problem.
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| Tuesday, July 12, 2011 - 12:02 am you could order the missing parts yourself I notice shuttle companies don't order shuttle fuselage. I had to buy 1 to finish 1 then close being it was at .99 completed
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| Thursday, July 14, 2011 - 01:18 am 4 more Cargo Shuttle corporations closed, and another 6 are going to close unless over a Trillion SC$ per corporation is used to 'save' them. What is happening, again, is the 'auto-orders' continue ordering when supplies aren't delivered, and will -repeat- orders over-and-over again, creating -redundant orders- that sit in the queue. Then, what happens, is one world month, they all delivers -simultaneously- and cause a Trillion SC$ shortfall causing the corporations, -even with 100B SC$ cash and no debt- to then immediately close. These corporations are "beta corporations" or even "alpha" stage, and have obviously not been tested or operated by 'Gamemaster' for any length of time. The only reason several still exisit is that they are either re-built, or the hiring or production are so low, that they effectively just sit there doing nothing, in which case they don't close for a while. 'Gamemaster' please check enterprise "Space Inc" on Kebir Blue to verify the graphs. It's clearly obvious, that cash levels sit at 100B SC$ cash for all world months, then suddenly drop at once to less than -1T SC$ cash and close. Upon closing, the owner is then charged for those massive amounts of supplies, un-used, that are in the 20, 30, or 40 world months in stock, which effectively is like a massive Trillion SC$ penalty on top of losing stored Cargo Shuttles un-sold, worth 3-5 Gold Coins as well as the corporation itself, which cost 1T SC$ to start. 4 corporations closed, with all those supplies and assets, is worth about 3T SC$ each. So, that's about 12T SC$ from these 4 that just closed.
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| Friday, July 15, 2011 - 11:55 pm This is what is stopping me from building a cargo shuttle corporation. I have the supply corporations up and running but the clear threat of premature closure and wasted money is all too apparent.
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| Saturday, July 16, 2011 - 01:24 am There are ways around it, but with the 180B SC$ 'spending limit' for corporations it takes either a lot of patience and time or you basically can have the corporation sit idle for a while while you build up the supplies and cash compensation together. Also, if you can then contract on top of that, to keep the 'auto-order' from taking over, it would be better. The thing is, even if all of these were done, the long-term weakness of the low cash levels --relative to-- the high cost of even 1 world months supplies creates a real weakness. The other thing to be careful of, that needs 'update' also, is how to sell the Cargo Shuttles once completed, as a few sold to one country cause 'spending limit' problems again, and apparently the contracts just 'auto-cancel' from some 'server exception'. The bottom line is, things need to change with how 'cash limits' and 'spending space limits' are done with the corporations. They should have 1T SC$ cash allowed at all times, and the spending space should also be 1T SC$, for example. Those aren't 'fixed' numbers, just based on what has been 'recommended' by 'Gamemaster' and observed for supply purchases in about 25 of these corporations.
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| Sunday, July 17, 2011 - 01:05 am at this time, for some one that wants to get started in the space industry, this is how i recommend doing it. buy up, and horde all the space stock you can. once you've got a nice amount, *then* build your shuttle corp. and use the local option under trade to manually sell the parts to the corp. and immediately after, raise the cash to max in the corp. keep manually supplying and infusing cash this way. once the first shuttle sale goes through, things get much easier. as long as you keep the corp supplied, you will have a successful space industry. what kills the shuttle corps, is the sudden purchasing of supplies. more so than the max cash can handle. and the fact that most the time, on any given world, the demand for space parts is outrageous. even though i love the worker requirements for space parts. they are rather stiff, and difficult. only one type actually makes a profit, with out serious effort. so it adds to the difficulty of supply. the other difficulty with space corps, is as said above. the spending limits. buying shuttles with your country, is dramatically difficulty to buy any significant number of shuttles, and still have enough for your country's other needs. even spreading them out over your empire, only weakens your empire. when reviewing my statement, keep in mind, i've been successful at maintaining 12 shuttle corps on LU. I put them all in one country, trying to minimalize the effort it'd take to maintain them. and now am wishing i'd put them a couple different worlds, rather than all in one place. soon i'll be able to IPO them, and move them out. but that wont solve the spending limit problem. and would infact make it more difficult to keep them supplied.
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| Tuesday, July 19, 2011 - 11:37 am Music for Space Players  I am still holding back on building a cargo shuttle corporation until some of these issues have been resolved.
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