| David Walker (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 03:02 am 
No nuclear weapons in Tommi.
If the resolution is accepted, the country will be under permanent investigation of the INC.
The Resolution was setup by President John Henry Eden with the following motivation:
Greetings, great people of sc, Tom has recently banned me from chat and forms cause he didn’t like me arguing with me. What a shock he is acting like a child. Same thing has happened to one of our dearest friends SuperSoldierRCP. He like bringing up my last proposal and boycott request on the post….Well I am proposing the same thing on this childish GM. When will it end, banning people for no reason, a gm that you can’t really talk to without causing him to do a taper tantrum. He is one of the problems with this game that will never get resolved. I say to you Tom, un -ban me and supersoldier from chat and form and we can resolve our differences like adults. This childish behavior of yours needs to stop…..People of the security council, propose for this so that my message gets to every president on LU….If this is not resolved, I will just leave this game and not come back…..from the info of my account, you will see that I am a valuable assets to this game, so please get your head out of your butt Tom |
| David Walker (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 03:03 am
I am voting against this proposal. It is effectively meaningless but symbolic. The case was made and the defence won.
SC members should not abuse their power.
I vote against. |
| Gringo (White Giant) | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 04:17 am
That guy is not making much sense! Its kinda like 'wiping before you poo'!!! Does not make sense.
HaHa.. And what is a 'taper tantrum'? |
| Apocolipse | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 06:26 am
lol imgine that more problems with president john henry drama and his seat on the security council. this marks the third time in under a month hes tried to use his power of the security council to bully other players unfairly, he only introduces proposals to serve his and only his needs.
so here we are again we have to stop developing our economies one more time to deal with his hot tempered nonsense. after he tries to bully carlos into giving him 300 trillion in goods or else john drama's security council will ban him from defending himself with nuclear weapons and publicly slandering carlos as a cheater and a scammer. the gamemaster discloses that john henry moved all the items in question out of the country three hours after it was purchased ,not carlos before it was handed over hmmm guess you didnt know gamemaster has logs th show these things huh?
now in responce to being found out he lied by the gamemasters logs and arguing in another topic relentlessly ( not very good argument either john made himself look foolish and imature in those exchanges ) he wants to submit yet another proposal to benifit himself only, ban the gamemaster from using nukes . are you kidding me lol
someone on the security council needs to propose a ban againts john henry hes been in the middle of all this security ouncil drama wich has left the players with no faith in the council hes the one that needs to be punished untill he learns hes not everyones daddy in the sc comunity hes like a rabid dog hes always in middle of all the drama and out of control talking continuos lies and nonsense, please lets put this proposal to vote or someone give him the drama he wants in a war this guys just beggin for it. someone put this clown in his place |
| J. Skullz (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 07:42 am
Psst...Hey, don't think so!!! |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, September 21, 2011 - 11:50 am
Just to defend JHE - if he wants to accuse CG of something, that's his right as a player. He may have made himself look silly, but it's not Tom's job to prove him wrong. Does anyone else think it weird that a GM, who can theoretically give himself infinite resources etc., is not only playing the game, but getting involved in its politics? |
| Lorelei | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 03:00 am
Apocolipse,
.....and who are you? lol |
| David Walker (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 03:22 am
Accordion, if a player accuses another of breaking the game rules, then it is for the GM to sort it out and not players.
Players should be playing and not managing the game. |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 11:41 am
I agree, David. But the GMs should be managing these "breaking of game rules" outside of the game.
Players have a right to accuse each other of what they wish. That's why I've recently been accused of being "like Hitler" by Westy, and that's why CG was accused of breaking rules by JHE. Although I don't agree with the attempt to attack CG through the Security Council, it is perfectly within JHE's rights to do these kinds of things if he so chooses.
I guess I'm just defending player's liberty, and attacking GM interventionism. |
| Orbiter (Fearless Blue) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 03:47 pm
their has been allot of accusations, about players cheating. and honestly, all it takes is the accusation, to make people think some one is guilty, reguardless of the truth
in the real world, if you work as a care provider for the elderly, all you need is to be accused of stealing, to loose your job...
in sim country, all you need is to be accused of cheating. to be branded a cheater. once john henry placed the accusation. the only one that could clear him, was Tom. who tried to handle it privately.
frankly, their was nothing carlos could have said or done to prove his innocence. i mean, look at the way the john argued with tom? carlos posting a message from the gm, would not have been more convincing. |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 03:53 pm
I don't know what you mean by "my group", but I personally have nothing against Tom or what he does. What I am against is this behaviour of arguing with players on the forums and taking sides in Simcountry politics. Granted, CG's name could only be cleared by evidence provided by Tom, but Tom could easily have provided this evidence to CG so that CG could defend himself. And, as I've already said to Tom - I never heard about this until Tom made his post on the forums. If he had conducted his GM business in private, as he should, none of this public disgracing or argument would have happened.
I have made no demeaning statements, and I don't believe I'm a martyr. My case is clear: Tom has repeatedly broken fair GM conduct, and it's time for that to be recognised. Tom needs to rein in his need to argue with players, and his need to intervene in world politics, and just act like a proper GM. Demeaning statements? None. Martyr syndrome? Personally, I'm not particularly interested in JHE's argument or CG's argument. I'm not taking sides - I'm trying to show that Tom has conducted himself poorly. |
| Blueserpent (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 04:00 pm
How? lol.
JHE brought a complaint and accusations to the forums, to the gm's and to the sc.
As a gm, Tommi replied in order to clear slades name. Which as a gm, he has every right to do so
The wrong doing in all this is JHE and because he couldnt keep his mouth shut and kept pushing....it all came out on the forum
Its not about sides being taken...its about down right dishonesty from JHE |
| Orbiter (Fearless Blue) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 04:04 pm
except when you go over the top, or near it. then claim that if you get banned, its only proof of what you say. thats what i mean when i say martyr syndrome.
no, the personal accusations of cheating, have gone above and beyond. it only takes a handful of people to believe, and they'll keep talking about it. until another handful beleive them.
not to terribly recently, a player told me that the burden of proof to prove that i don't multi, is on me? how the hell am i going to prove i'm not a multi. and after months, of insults, lies, and plots, i've finally managed to have won the battle. Carlos did not deserve to go through that. symply because john wanted to scam him.
this is a game. you want to war some one fine. but destroying some ones reputation, just to get 300T of assets, is a bit much. if the gm let things like that continue, good players, such as carlosg, AKA slade, wont want to play
and by the way, slade, has been around for quite some time, and is a very experienced, and capable war player, to say the least. he is fully capable of defending himself in game. the only way to clear him of cheating.... well only tom could do that
think on that, before you say tom shouldn't have gotten involved |
| David Walker | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 04:12 pm
I don't believe Tom has intervened in game politics but simply managed something under his jurisdiction.
JHE mixed the 2 which I think was unwise. Everything else that's not game rules is available to players as a strategy.
Accoridon, being called "hitler" is part of game politics and not the rules so that's fine. I don't even have a problem of forum posts to request investigations into a potential breaking of the rules but to mix them up into the game isn't part of the game.
No-one plays a game to be accused of breaking the rules to which we all play by. |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 04:34 pm
It's a tough nut to crack, but I think my point still stands. Although Tom is justified in showing CG to be innocent, I don't think he should be doing it so publicly. As has already been stated, CG is perfectly capable of defending himself - why not give Slade the evidence and let him defend himself?
There are nothing in the rules that say it's against the rules to accuse someone of cheating/multi-ing. What has happened to Orbiter and Slade (accusations, that is) is unfair, but players are allowed to say unfair things. If the GM intervenes to disgrace one side or the other, that only adds to the unfairness of the situation.
Perhaps accusing players of cheating should be a bannable offence. But, if so, it should be written down, and, when a player accuses another of cheating, he should be banned from the forums and the GM should not intervene any further.
In a game of politics, it's only fair that politics are allowed to unfold. |
| David Walker (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 05:11 pm
There doesn't need to be a rule in the game rules to say don't accuse another player of cheating. It is simply kind and respectful as a player not to do so. We can be as aggressive in our game strategies as we like but the game rules are there to define a game we can all play and know what we're playing.
When I lead the largest fed in Simcountry several years back, I had no problem in disciplining members and in public way if necessary. That is part of the game. You're avid defence of JHE and no humility is a cause of concern on LU.
You've said very little about JHE's actions and much on the GM, it does not look good for the IDC.
I suggest changing media strategies. |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 08:45 pm
Personally, I see no politics in this. This is the sort of irritating crap that needs to end.
I'm tired of the constant stream of accusations of "cheating" and "multi-abuse" that are all invariably unfounded and the proof is of course "mysterious sources."
If the GMs are going to try to cut down on the infantile crap going on, more power to them, and if they catch a few legit ones along the way and cut them out of the game, even better. |
| ZentrinoRisen (Little Upsilon) | Friday, September 23, 2011 - 01:11 am
Just from my perspective, I don't really care if someone accuses another of cheating or being a multi. We see that all time on here and I seldom pay any attention to it.
However, I am glad the GM cleared this up, not because I care one or the other about who did what to whom. But, I want to know if I buy a country that the owner can't do what JHE accused Slade of doing. The GM clearing that up in public allows players to continue to have confidence in the system of buying countries. |
| Orbiter (Little Upsilon) | Friday, September 23, 2011 - 02:18 am
frankly, the accusations of multi, and other cheating, reminds me of the stories from the old witch hunt days...
you didn't have to prove some one was a witch. you just had to point and shout. has that all thats become of sim country politics? it would seem so.
props to Tom for sticking up for an innocent player!!
accusing some one of cheating, shouldn't be 'politics,' and is should have no place in the game. but it has gotten so carried away, that john henry thought he could slip one by. but i guess thier is a limit. i'm glad to know that. i'm sorry that some one actually thought they'd get away with it. |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Friday, September 23, 2011 - 02:36 am
David - JHE is not an IDC member. I'm not defending him for the IDC - I'm attacking Tom's conduct as a paid member who doesn't like the direction of this game.
If you want to know what I think of JHE: I think he's overreacted. I think he shouldn't have initiated that Security Council vote, I think he should have conducted himself in private. I think Slade did the right thing in arguing this issue in private rather than attacking JHE in the public arena.
I think the GM has failed, both now and in the past, to act like a mature arbiter. I think that Tom has, time and time again, been dragged into the ridiculous politics of this game. I think that, when he gets involved, he gets angry, sometimes rude, and this is not what a GM should be doing. That's all I am saying - please don't twist my words and accuse me of defending JHE or defending accusations of cheating. |
| David Walker (Little Upsilon) | Friday, September 23, 2011 - 03:00 am
Sorry, I thought I remembered seeing Raven Rock in IDC, obviously not.
I think the general opinion is that Tom hasn't interfered in game politics.
Ok, so you weren't directly defending JHE but by concentrating your attack on JHE, it seemed as such.
It would have been best as a side note on the issue and not the main thrust.
I want this game to be enjoyable and not for players to be falsely accused of cheating or a GM nowhere to be seen when it is occurring.
I welcome Tom's interaction and you're in a minority thinking Tom has intervened in game politics. |
| Lorelei (White Giant) | Friday, September 23, 2011 - 04:00 am
I think this whole thing is being blown way out of proportion and I can't help questioning,,,,,why? It is starting to come across to me as a so called "smear campaign" against Tom Willard. If you have issues with the behavior of a GM, take it up with the GMs via email. I think this is the appropriate method if you have any issue in the game. They have always answered my inquiries promptly and fairly, and I truly think they are trying to stop some of the nonsense and bashing that has seemed to take over the game for quite some time.
I appreciate their input. Let's me know they are paying attention. Accordian, you have made your issue with Tom known. Now put it to rest, and let's go forward.
Let the fun begin!
Jan |
| Accordion_This (Little Upsilon) | Sunday, September 25, 2011 - 03:39 am
I'm sorry that this has come across as a smear campaign. It's unfortunate that I've had to defend my argument against so many people, and this defence is what has made it appear as a campaign rather than a quick statement.
The reason it was posted on the forums, and defended there, was because Tom's post against JHE and Tom's arguments with players are on the forums. It's only appropriate that I address him in his arena. |
