| Andy | Wednesday, October 18, 2023 - 10:07 am 
The financial consequences of having wind farms are now visible on the income and cost page.
The correct numbers will probably stabilize and show exact results after additional 2 days after all the year to date and estimated full year data are recomputed several times.
The first to show correct results is the current income and cost of wind farms.
we hope that the data will clear up questions about the profitabiliy and risks of wind farms. |
| Unsthable | Wednesday, October 18, 2023 - 05:00 pm
I appreciate the effort. I'm not a programmer so while on my end I only see a number change which doesn't look like much, I know more the process to get those numbers in the right spots is an involved one. So while I have presented issues a fair amount lately, and am about to again, I don't want it to be thought that the work you do isn't recognized. It is. Especially this many years into the game.
With that, the financial consequences of having Wind Farms are still not accurately represented, and from the appearance of the last couple in game months since your update they won't be after your in game year. I hope that I am wrong, but the information in front of makes me believe that won't be the case.
I would share screenshots on here to make it easier to follow, unfortunately I'm not savvy enough to know how to insert them. So just a numbers barrage.
The issue:
Wind Farms Income is calculated as (# of Wind Farms in country * 1250 * market price of Electric Power).
The accurate calculation of Wind Farms Income is (# of Wind Farms in country * 1250 * market price of Electric Power * Quality of Electric Power)
This matters because quality is a consideration in every other part of income and cost accounting for countries where products are involved, including Wind Farm costs. With the current error, having more Wind Farms actually artificially lowers your Financial Index closer to 100 if you have decent quality Electric Power while in truth your country is earning substantially more with each farm.
Using examples from one of my countries to help lay out a true in game representation:
- Country has 783 Wind Farms
- Electric Power Quality is 337
- Wind Turbine Quality is 135
- Electric Power monthly use by country is 138,049
- Population spendings on Electric Power is 1.469B
Current Game Income/Expense Results:
Wind Farms Income - 368.734B
Wind Farms Cost - 200.69B
Electric Power Cost - 173.800B
Total Income/Expense - -5.756B
The Electric Power cost is one of the hidden keys here. Government buildings consume Electric Power each month. Those costs have Electric Power quality factored in. So the EP use of 138,049 multiplied by market value and EP quality, with population spendings subtracted from that amount gives the total that the government is consuming as a cost. Electric Power consumption by the government isn't directly tied to the Wind Farms, but the farms are providing the electricity being consumed and the accounting is only accurate for the expense side, which artificially deflates Financial Index.
Accurate Game Income/Expense Results:
Wind Farms Income - 1242.63B
Wind Farms Cost - 200.69B
Electric Power Cost - 173.800B
Total Income/Expense - 868.143B
Now changing the calculation to be accurate won't actually change anything for the player in terms of what they are truly earning and spending. The fix will show the correct results that are accurate to the country's financial index however. And Financial Index matters. This country doesn't have particularly high indexes in education or health, and where Electric Power is concerned the Financial Index would actually be under 100, where Electricity is the country's biggest profit maker by far. Because Finance Index is a contributing factor to Game Level and Game Level determines many things for the players such as what corporations can be built and welfare index bonuses at higher game levels, it should be important to have the income/cost reporting be accurate.
I've brought this up a few times, the first time you said you didn't see a need and wouldn't elaborate past that. Any other time I've brought it up the message was completely ignored. I am hoping that is not the case this time and I presented the issue in a way that is easy enough to follow why the change to an accurate accounting matters. |
| Daniel Iceling | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 02:04 am
Andy,
I think Wind Power should be added at 120 Quality, rather than at whatever quality the country has in stock.
The current stockpile shouldn't determine the quality of newly produced electric power. It makes no sense that a Wind Farm could produce 2.75 times as much value, just because the existing stockpile of electric power is 330 Quality, rather than 120 Quality.
Then, all electric power produced by wind farms, could be counted as 120 Quality in the finance index. Making it an accurate representation of the actual financial impact wind farms have on the country. |
| SuperSoldierRCP | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 05:33 am
To mention Daniels point
The GM could easily change it so "Wind Farm Quality" averaged with "Wind Turbines Quality," = Quality of Wind power added.
Problem solved  |
| Andy | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 08:56 am
Wind farm electric power should be added at Q100 or Q120.
The financial result for the country profit and loss is very simple.
It is the income from wind farm, less the maintenance cost.
the margin is more than 250 million per game month per wind farm on average.
This is in fact too high for a single item. It can overshadow anything else in the country finances. A better value will be 100 million and another 50 to compensate for a possible turn to losses.
We could introduce full quality for the EP coming from wind farms, but to keep the margin at less than 250, or 150 million, we will have to increase the maintenance cost by a huge factor, use 2 or 3 or even 4 wind turbines per winf farm per game month and probably double their price.
Such a change will also dilute the financial index which depends not on the profit but mainly on the pecentage difference between income and cost.
Add a lot to both sides and the financial index will decline.
also the risk will become much higher.
Even a smaller decline in the price of EP could reduce the income of a country and create huge losses because the maintenance cost will remain at the smae level. |
| Orbiter | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 12:24 pm
Quote:This is in fact too high for a single item. It can overshadow anything else in the country finances.
I agree in prinicple. My disagreement is, because of wind farms, we actually have a game again. Folks can do stuff they couldn't do before, and its exciting. Don't take that away, because you think its to much, you'll choke the enthusiasm out, again |
| Andy | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 01:35 pm
Wind farms are here to stay and will remain very profitable and attractive.
Please please please build wind farms.
The entire discussion is not with players who are setting up wind farms.
it is about overdoing it.
There is ony a very small number of players who want 5000 of these wind farms and want the maintenance problem to go away. |
| Unsthable | Thursday, October 19, 2023 - 01:59 pm
I can’t tell if any of what you’ve said today even responded to anything I said, which makes me believe it didn’t. |
