| MantoArms | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 03:04 pm 
Scottish Independence
Do you think the SNP will win this vote ?
Do you think its a good thing ?
What will the UK look like with a Independent Scotland ?
Is there a North -South Divide ?
A couple of rules , please state were u are from so we can understand youre pespective .
Keep it sensible and no name calling .
I can not see how it can be economical wise to split the Union for anyone . I would agree that London is a economical power house of the UK and Europe , but it would still suffer if Scotland won its Independence .
On the other hand i can see how tempting it would be for the Scottish people to Gain there Independence . After all they were independent before England forced themselves on to Scotland . But that was history and occured a long time ago , is it rigth you use that as a basis of Independence .
No i dont think the SNP will win the vote .
I think the whole of the UK would suffer , so no i dont think it would be a good thing .
Yes i do think there is a North /South Divide , in England and the UK .
I am from Corbridge , North East of England. Which makes me a Notherner . |
| Teddy Bear | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 09:58 pm
I'm not sure your going to get that many people on here with such an in depth understanding of Scottish politics.
Its not about the SNP winning a vote. Its about the people of Scotland deciding whether they want to be an independent country or stay part of the UK.
Peace and cookies  |
| shave | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 10:18 pm
yea what he said.....uhh....with brownies..with chocolate chips in them and whip cream on the side. |
| MantoArms | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 10:21 pm
Quote "Its not about the SNP winning a vote. Its about the people of Scotland deciding whether they want to be an independent country or stay part of the UK."
I stand corrected . |
| nix001 | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 10:40 pm
Hi Manto.
Westminster, before the coalition, had The Scottish Labour Party incontrol of it. Everything that could have been done to make sure Scotland can go it alone has been done. So economically, Scotland can survive. I'm in the process of starting The England Reformation Party to address the issues England will need to look out for when the split takes place. FaceBook England Reformation Party to see some of these issues. And please make a comment if you see fit. |
| Wilhelm II Hohensteinburg | Monday, October 15, 2012 - 11:19 pm
It would be strange to see a divided Great Britain, but then again, if the people want to be independent, they have the right to be so. |
| Dimitri Mendelev | Tuesday, October 16, 2012 - 02:40 am
i dont understand british politics because im an american who has poor public education......we still got the best military though ;)
i cant imagine a split though scotland and england cant be much more different then north and south here
and nix i will definitely check out your party |
| Dimitri Mendelev | Wednesday, October 17, 2012 - 02:04 am
nix you don't have much a platform |
| Tallisibeth na Colliete | Wednesday, October 17, 2012 - 08:55 am
Well, at least they're not doing what the Confederacy did. I don't think that Scotland has a R. E. Lee at their disposal. |
| MantoArms | Wednesday, October 17, 2012 - 03:02 pm
I think a comparison of the Federal goverment and the native red indian would be closer . England and Scotland was no civil war . Except the balance was more even . There was a time Scotland almost took England . |
| Lord Arbuckle | Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 05:59 am
Im in Australia and have only seen a little about it in the news, so dont know much of the issue...
On top of their independence, do they desire to go down the Republic path or retain HM the Queen as their HOS? |
| Wilhelm II Hohensteinburg | Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 06:03 am
The Basque and Catalonia States in Spain are threatening to secede from Spain.
Very interesting developments in Western Europe. |
| MantoArms | Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 11:55 am
I am not aware of any plans of a Republic . i think they will keep HM as head of state .
James VI was king of Scotland before he was also made King of Englnad ( or Union ) in 1603 . So a Scotish King did win the English Throne at one point . Mind you if my momory serves me correct the present Royal Family are from a differnet line . |
| Teddy Bear | Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 10:43 pm
As far as I know, they plan is to keep the queen as head of state, but have independent military, and importantly for Scottish Politics, get the nuclear weapons moved out of Scotland, which is the only place in the UK that has them.
Its quite complex and quite simple really. |
| Crafty | Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 02:24 pm
Its nothing to do with military, it's an economic decision, Scotland being able to pay its part of the UK bills without going into the red, they feel cheated that they are bailing out the English.
And Scottish law is somewhat different to English, something most of Scotland (I think it's most, don't actually have the figures, but Alex Hammond says so) something they wish to retain 'sovereignity' of.
Did you know, Scottish university education is completely paid for by the state? Yep, 100%, and Scotland has some world reknown uni's. St. Andrews for one. |
| Teddy Bear | Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 08:26 pm
Craft my friend, you are mistaken, this is taken from the SNP website. :-
SNP Leader Alex Salmond has reinforced the Scottish National Party's complete opposition to Trident nuclear weapons in Scotland by saying that the SNP believe this should be enshrined in a written constitution for an independent Scotland.
The SNP leader said:
âThe SNP Government will be bringing forward a white paper on independence which proposes a written constitution for an independent Scotland, and that constitution will have to be ratified by the Scottish Parliament elected in 2016.
âThe SNP position on this is that the constitution should include an explicit ban on nuclear weapons being based on Scottish territory.
This reinforces the SNPâs unshakable opposition to nuclear weapons, and that is the context in which we will debate NATO at the forthcoming party conference.
âThe resolution to be debated at conference does make an independent Scotlandâs membership of NATO conditional on the acceptance of Scotlandâs non-nuclear status, in line with the vast majority of current NATO members.â
You were almost right about our Universities though.We have to pay about 1/3 up from compared to English students, and the government gives us low interest loans that we dont pay back until we start earning over £15K.
Peace |
| Crafty | Sunday, October 21, 2012 - 03:31 pm
Thanks Ted for your obviously first hand knowledge.
Though I see the issue of Trident being based in Scotland as obviously quite important to the SNP, I dont see it as the main reason for Scotlands desire for devolution.
Anyways, good luck to yous, I hope you have thought it out thoroughly. |
| Teddy Bear | Sunday, October 21, 2012 - 04:54 pm
Yeah, its just a factor.
The economy and a large share of our revenue going to support the rest of the UK are important point too.
But for some people, it comes down to wanting to in charge of our own destiny.
Not only did the English Monarchy assume all authority over Scotland, but they stole all our sacred artifacts that allowed us to crown our own Kings, such as the Stone of Scoone.
Yes, this was 300 years ago, but the stone was only returned a few years ago, and there are many sore points of history since then.
In the 80's Thatcher introduced the Poll Tax, which was £500 a house, and applied to only Scotland. Can you imagine that? Thats the equivalent of Obama turning round and saying that everyone in Colorado would be taxed an extra $2000 a year! Just madness.
But like you say Crafty, it will be interesting to see what we can do with it once we get it...fingers crossed. |
| Laguna | Monday, October 22, 2012 - 02:29 am
Quote:It is a general truism of this world that anything long divided will surely unite, and anything long united will surely divide.
- Romance of the Three Kingdoms
With that said, scotsmen should ponder precisely the future they desire and the best mean of achieving it. |
| MantoArms | Tuesday, October 23, 2012 - 02:15 am
Quote " In the 80's Thatcher introduced the Poll Tax, which was ã500 a house, and applied to only Scotland. Can you imagine that? "
Not sure about that , I was very much against this "poll Tax " . I live in the north east and i also had to pay it . In fact the whole U.K did .
England ( or at least the Monarchy ) have a lot to answer for for what they did to Scotland ,Wales and Ireland . But they are dead so the best that can be done is give u all a choice of Independence .
Personally i would rather be part of Scotland than England , because i believe Edinburgh would listen to me and be more compassionate than any party in London . But i can not deny that i believe it would be a mistake to break up the Union which now has its own History . We all started from small kingdoms in history , all sorts of cultures from the Celts , Picts ,Scoti ,Roman ,saxon , Viking ,Norman ( the house of Bruce were Normans ) , but in time they became one Country . England , Scotland , Wales and Northern Ireland have now come together to create The Union , it has its own History and Culture , Yes it migth of been greed and force of arms that has brougth us together , but we are.
I hope we stay together but if Scotland decides to go it alone then they have my full support . |
| MantoArms | Tuesday, October 23, 2012 - 02:23 am
Mind you after watching a few debates in Scottish Parliament i have to admit I am not to sure of Alex Salmond . He is strong and i like the way he treats Westminster but he does come across as another modern day politician . Full of Shit , says anything that will get him the power he so craves .
For example .
The decision to give 16 and 17 year old a vote is more about Alex Salmond playing a political move to get a winning vote than to give the young a say . If he thougth givivng 16 and 17 year olds a vote would go against him he would not of pushed for it . It was a political desicion for himself and the SNP not for the young people of Scotland , he is hopeing the romantic thougth of a Independent Scotland will persuade the young . A modern day politician . I hate them all lol |
| Crafty | Tuesday, October 23, 2012 - 11:37 am
Meh, the Jocks will come crawling back when they realise that Mars Bars are made in the south of England. |
