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Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 03:17 pm  WTF is up with you Londoners? I don't understand how you protest the Government by destroying and looting local businesses. Why don't you just throw some tea into the North Sea? That seems to get the Crown's attention...
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 03:28 pm i agree i think the police shooting is being used as an excuse for criminals to steal things and burn down things. setting business on fire and stealing from stores is not protesting its criminality.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 03:40 pm Damn it! I love London! Stop burning it down. The Royal family should be leading the charge on horseback against these hooligans. Get some good use out of all those polo lessons!
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 04:24 pm Maybe if they used their cups 'o tea to dash the flames it be out by now.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 08:31 pm At least go after the food industries. Get a proper pastry in there for goodness sake! Rally for better tacos! Make it *mean* something, not just burning down the local pub.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 08:44 pm Bunch of feral youth. Police, teachers, youth workers etc, HELL, even parents, aren't allowed to chastise their children. So they've grown up with the "you can't touch me" attitude "or I'll take you to court" thing. See where political correctness gets you? Its been coming for ages, you could feel it on the streets. At bit of hardship now with economic pressure, one incidient where a thug shot at a policeman and got shot to death by said policeman, and they went to town. He took his chance and he lost the gunfight, TOUGH. Very soon now the vigilante groups will be out, there are rumours some are assembling right now as I write this. There are 1000s of regular people to every one of these yobs and society aint gonna stand for it for long. Not the ideal way to sort it out, but the cops can only do so much before they risk being called heavy handed and police state etc etc. The British spirit will conquer, have no fear my American cousins.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:09 pm Damn CC
you said it all right there. But in America, the politicians are now drumming up that rhetoric you heard in Greece after the default on their debt made the politicians steal the pensions and so on. In America, it ain't happening. They aren't just expecting it, they are prepared for it. Think those FEMA Detention camps are for nothing? War is coming to this Planet. WW3 is the citizens vs. Governments.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:20 pm Now, I'm going to check the the batteries in my survival kit.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:26 pm As the beatles said: "We all want a revolution.." and then go on to say something about if its violent then count me out. OK yeah, it is coming for sure, and good. But trashing your own hood to make your voice heard? I was in LosAng in the aftermath of the Watts riots, more racial I know but did it really achieve the desire? Hell no, poor black people still crush aluminum cans under bus wheels to sell for scrap to get a meal a day. This is Los Angeles!!! not Delhi. We have to get justice, transparency et al, but not by giving govts excuse to mow us down. Egypt did it. Most of the middle east is in the middle of it, who's gonna win?
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:37 pm Jeez, first the Canucks, now the Brits. Next thing you know, Gandhi and Mother Theresa will be rising from their graves and throwing rocks through a store window. This is something I'd expect over here in the good old U.S.A.... but the Republicans keep most of the people too stupid to realize that a riot is in order. Probably a good thing, since we have zero gun control and a terrible public health system.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:50 pm Gun control stops nothing. It empowers criminals and weakens otherwise law abiding citizens from defending themselves. All the criminals have the high powered automatic assault rifles and sub-machine guns. Law abiding citizens have deer rifles and hand-guns tucked away in gun cases under lock and key.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:55 pm Did anyone see the footage of a guy getting beaten once, falling on the ground trying to get away, and just as the policeman steps back, he gets up, defies the policeman to smack him again? You can see that as he defies, he gets ready to run. Yes, these are cowards.
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| Tuesday, August 9, 2011 - 09:55 pm My pick-axe handle pwns your AK47 
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 12:37 am Billy Bob, you should live in Arizona. Our gun laws are lax. Is "London's Burning" playing on British airways or what?
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 01:32 am Just one thing, Crafty ... the 'thug' didn't shoot the policeman. The gunshot that was fired at the policemen has been traced back to a bullet that was police issue and didn't match the handgun that the victim was alleged to have used. I'm not condoning violence or opportunistic looting, but when you have a government that focuses necessary austerity measures on preserving profits and taking away the little that the disadvantaged members of society have, rather than penalising the fat-cats who caused the problems, there is bound to be some fallout. The last time this happened in the UK (and unsurprisingly, it started in the same disadvantaged area in London) was ... drumroll ... around six years after Margaret Thatcher became Prime Minister, with similar screw-the-poor-so-long-as-the-rich-people-are-alright values. Nothing is ever black and white, and it's not as easy as you think to lay the blame. Hugs and respect Jo
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 01:43 am 3 years ago London (minority) elected a Conservative (right wing) mayor (Boris) who's first priorities was to cut funds that enouraged integration and understanding. Race equality festivals, youth support, events and organisations had funding withdrawn. Housing is in incredible short-supply and now the Conservative (with Liberal partners) government is reducing the funding to enable people to live in their home areas and rather than clamping down on rents they are withdrawing the funding to the individual making them homeless. The right to live in a 1 bed flat is now being raised from 25 to 35 giving them another 10 years of living in smelly rooms or bedsits, without work and higher inflation, watching the rich look down on them. Ken Livingstone (the previous mayor) had excellent plans for creating a one London with plans to support every community and everyone but then he's a REAL Londoner, where as Boris is just part of the Upper classes, rich and only calls for taxes on the rich to be cut. Boris has allowed for more people to be made homeless, housing building not taking place and for the homeless on the street to be moved out of London so they can't be seen when the olympics is on. Criminality is always wrong but then despair, desperation, poverty, isolationism and anger will boil over if not handled well like Ken. I BLAME Boris! I speak as a former resident in London with friends in all parts of London.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 01:44 am Here, here, Jo.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 01:59 am Come at us in Southall and we'll show them who the victims are. No tramps gonna be touching us.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 05:43 pm The poor ar'nt as badly done to in the UK as you all seem to think, they're are all a waste of space and recieve very generous benefits at that, they cause nothing but trouble and stir trouble and like nothing but making trouble. Do you lot really think for a second they want to have jobs and who the hell would want to employ that lot anyway? if I was an employer and running my own business I can tell you right now I would'nt want to employ them at all. Green Paws why are you so against Boris Johnson and the conservative govenment? they're doing all they can to put an end to this rioting of which the rioters will most likely be labour supporters as I know the working classes and other scum in this country only too well from my own personal experience.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 06:23 pm Jo, he had a gun and so was a threat, more than a threat, what was the copper supposed to do? Anyway, this was a so called trigger (no pun intended) in Tottenham, an area of London. Guns and murder are common place, why this one? And what has it to do with Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool etc.? OK, I agree with you that there is a lack of morale (for want of a better word) amongst the less priveledged in England, but to blame the so called rich is ridiculous. Its called capitalism, the philosophy of the US and UK and many western countries. The poor can help themselves, many do, but giving people everything they demand/want (as opposed to need) merely encourages people to do nothing for themselves. You'll notice some of my posts in this game show my deep belief in this, if someone cant be bothered to try then they get no sympathy from me.. You guys might have also seen live interviews with some offenders who openly claim that they know nothing of the issues or politics, they just want some fun and make some money... sheesh, nuff said. (I'm trying to find the interviews on you-tube and will post if I can) One last thing, nurture should be pro-active, not re-active. Allow people who care and who deal with unruly kids to do so effectively, dont wait until they get totally out of hand and then bang them up in jail, that has been proved time and again to be completely unhelpful. Only for use in cases where public safety is at risk from someone who can't be 'tamed'.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 07:39 pm This is why i like the good old US uncle sam, We as people of this great nation have the right to bear arms, if someone comes at me trying to hurt me ill shoot. I believe i read somewhere that we have more guns in the US so that every person in the U.S would have 2. Thats more than 600,000,000 guns in the U.S.A. Got to love our guns.
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| Wednesday, August 10, 2011 - 07:40 pm With 600,000,000 million guns that makes the U.S people the strongest ground force in the world, how about them apple's china.
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 01:24 am The poor are always badly dealt with no matter which country and if mismanaged will always be a powder keg waiting to explode. Capitalism is merely meant to be a way of providing for all with efficiency but once it loses its edge and it is isolating communities and people then it is the wrong system for a nation. Many criminals will claim benefits to hide their illegal activities but mnay youngsters can be prevented from this by early intervention, something pioneered by Labour. From the age 3 to the age 21, there were a host of interventionists and more under Ken in London. These worked worked in the difficult communities where many felt crime paid as an alternative to working as lowly paid workers ordered about. They watched their parents or grandparents do just that and have given up looking for justice and have the mindset of rampage. These problems cannot be dealt with in the long-term by tough justice if this is a contunituous problem, it must be intervened. I hagve personally been appalled by what has happened in the riots including of muggings of harmed victims but in the long-term (which this problem will span) a pragmatic response must be taken, and ensure that no community is left impoverished or ignored. Allowing communities to fall into despair like 200 years ago and accept that people are beyond help is unacceptable. People try to survive or fight back, wrongly or rightly. They're angry. Police must clamp down now but support services must be laid on to enable those to feel part of a community and to be able to feel they're worth jobs and enforce higher wages to allow families to be fed. When society gives up on someone, society has failed. If we didn't look the other way, we could have preveneted this. That's exactly what Boris is doing, cutting support services, ignoring the problems of depreived communities so that like "Lord of the Flies" this has become a fatal problem. For those who support guns, I would be scared to death if rioters came onto the streets and was able to access guns through whatever means. I don't want to carry a gun and nor do I want my neioghbour. If I'm attacked, I will defend with whatever means. The best means of defence is not to exploit the lower order in order to provide for the higher orders, so I fight against it. Criminality is a parasite of capitalism. The rich and the criminal classes exploit others, just one with the fist and the other with money. Money switches off my supply of life-living medicine (true) and fist brusise in the face. Clamp down now on criminals but if society doesn't change don't expect anything different!
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 04:21 pm @Gothamloki "I love London! Stop burning it down." S'alright. Most of the rioting has been confined to the 'burbs, Camden (which usually looks like a riot has recently passed through) and Oxford Circus (which is all generic shopping centre-y and not tourist-y). We haven't damaged anything pretty (although I hope the Oxford Circus riot didn't spread too far along Regent Street, which is pretty). @Psycho Honey "Maybe if they used their cups 'o tea to dash the flames it be out by now." Wash your mouth out! That is no way to treat a cuppa (yeah, it's a cuppa, not a "cup o' tea"). @Psycho Honey "Gun control stops nothing. It empowers criminals and weakens otherwise law abiding citizens from defending themselves." and @Quetzalcoatl "This is why i like the good old US uncle sam, We as people of this great nation have the right to bear arms, if someone comes at me trying to hurt me ill shoot." Depends on what you mean by 'Gun control'. Homicides are generally much lower in Europe than the U.S. because it's a lot harder to get hold of a gun ('gun control' aimed at restricted gun ownership). The notable exception is Switzerland, where every adult male is issued with a gun as they all have to do military service. That seems to have had a measureable effect on the homicide rate, but the conviction rate is high because all military issued-guns and -ammunition are serial numbered and traceable ('gun control' aimed at enabling wide-spread gun ownership). Give me restricted gun ownership any day. Our police don't need to carry guns as a matter of course, but can call on armed backup if needed. The occasional serial killer or other homicidal nutter does go on the rampage, but their number of victims is rarely higher than an equivalent nutter in the U.S. If the right to bear arms (and frequent assertions from gun-owners) did matter, the nutter should be gunned down pretty quickly by the nearest citizen and you'd have fewer victims per nutter. @Jo "Nothing is ever black and white, and it's not as easy as you think to lay the blame." Ah, the voice of reason. Hear, hear. Nothing is ever black and white, and those that think it is, usually have an over-simplified view of the world that makes their suggested responses next to useless. @All I don't think we've actually worked out what the trigger was. The shooting of Mark Duggan in Tottenham is widely held up as the initial trigger, but the local community seemed to support the police's actions once the circumstances had been explained. Direct comparisons with the 1980s riots don't fully apply as these highlighted widespread racism in the Metropolitan Police which has since been addressed resulting in fairly good relations between the police & local communities. Others have pointed to the widespread unemployment in the area. However, unemployment in the area was at 19% during the mid-noughties boom and has only risen to 20% now (BBC, 'The Daily Politics', Thu 11th Aug). Others have pointed to gang culture, but I'm not sure that explains how widespread the rioting was. Gangs aren't a significant issue in most areas and I doubt gang culture can account for the numbers of people involved in Tottenham. These also don't explain why the rioting spread across so many different cities and areas. My own thoughts on the cause is that it probably is partly to do with poverty, gang culture and, more significantly, a perception that things are only going to get worse for those at the bottom when the spending cuts start to hit. (This is where comparisons with the 1980s may rightfully be made.) This perception of a worsening situation, rather than immediate poverty, might account for why the rioters were looting rather than protesting and why it spread to other cities (there were even reports in Manchester that families were going out by car to go looting): sort of a 'why not stock up now?' attitude. I don't think we, as a nation, will be able to work out why it all kicked off without the benefit of hindsight and perhaps not even then. Nothing is ever black and white. Just to bring this up again. I have been rather pissed off (ex-colonials: that means angry) with journalists and locals, particularly in Manchester, saying that the vandalism and looting is not being done by 'true' Mancunians. There is no such thing as 'true' and 'false' Mancunians. It's too simplistic to label people like that, and categorising people into 'true' and 'false' Mancunians can only emphasise any divisions (whatever they are) that caused some Mancunians to riot. You get a similar division into true and false whenever a religious nut decides to take God's judgement into his/her own hands. After the attacks in Norway, Anders Breivik was cheerfully declared not to be a 'true Christian'. Face it - Christians can do good and bad things, just like atheists can do good and bad things, just like Londoners/Mancunians/citizens-of-anywhere can do good and bad things. Distancing yourself from groups of people by labelling them as 'not true whatevers', won't address the problem. All it achieves is a washing of hands and may tip a few sympathisers into picking the other side.
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 05:15 pm Nicely put Skander Hugs and respect Jo
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 06:55 pm FML I'm not going to a FEMA camp. They will never take me alive WENDY!
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 07:05 pm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnkdfFAqsHA >>>JFK The man who gave his life trying to give this country back to the people.
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| Thursday, August 11, 2011 - 08:51 pm Lol@Smokes you and me both! @Skandar, your response broke me head! You know without getting into stating every statistic in theory it works in reality it is a disaster. And please Cops w/o guns... wow? When the call goes out for man w/ a gun, and he kills 5 before your backup with a weapon shows up, everyone will begin to question why don't all officers have sidearms, because he would or could have been stopped sooner and preserved the loss of life.
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 12:39 am Here, here Skander
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 02:52 am @Skandar .. You werent trying to talk sence about guns to a yank were you ??
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 03:29 am That was a noble attempt at some really big words, but next time SPELL CHECK so you don't look like a m0r0n. ~yank
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 03:38 am I don't care for Brit sportscars but like the brit top gear over the US top gear
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 04:17 am in the last decade over 25% of Detroit moved out. this was a result of corruption in the city government and riots in the streets. no one did anything effective to stop it. in the past few weeks in Philadelphia the same thing is happening. however, in this case the black mayor and police chief are saying that the riots are being conducted by stupid ignorant thugs and that their actions will not be condoned. let's see if this works better than what the PM said about youth "not knowing the difference between right and wrong". horse hockey
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 05:34 am country in recession but tuesday our CPMH was double our daily goal and the company is not in a recession new stores lanes are always active except the holidays we are busting out stores like a simcountry CEO and we are expanding our internal industrial vehicles from crown Houston does no go in recession it grows maybe those Detroit people moved to Texas I wish the local pro teams would perform as well as the businesses ExxonMobil I guess the real heavy hitter
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 06:48 am That's a bad example. Detroit always sucked.
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 12:00 pm @Lord Eddie "You weren[']t trying to talk [sense] about guns to a yank were you?" How foolish of me. Us Europeans generally don't get Americans obsession with firearms. I believe you can get rifles & shotguns with the correct licence in this country, for hunting grouse and foxes and the like (from horseback, dressed in plus fours, handlebar moustache optional). Not sure how useful these would be in an urban shoot-out scenario. @Psycho Honey "And please Cops w/o guns... wow?" Works when it's difficult for criminals to get hold of guns. "everyone will begin to question why don't all officers have sidearms" Well, occasionally someone does pop up with a gun, and yet this question never gets asked, usually because said nutter goes on the run and it takes time to find him. Last case like this in England was Raoul Moat in 2010. The police had plenty of time to deploy firearms officers because no-one knew where he'd gone. We have about 2-4 deaths due to police shootings per year and if anything, the debate here is more critical of the 'shoot-to-kill' policy introduced after 11/9 (that's 9/11 for you ex-colonials) than whether we should have more armed officers. Following the fatal shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes in 2005 (who was mis-identified as a suspected terrorist), we are more likely to get rid of firearms officers than increase their numbers. Exception: I didn't know this until reading up on it now, but police officers in Northern Ireland are entitled to carry personal hand guns both on and off duty. This is a special case though due to the inter-communal tensions between Catholics and Protestants in N.I.
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 12:08 pm Damn, knew there was something else to comment on: @Matt Paton "I don't care for Brit sportscars That's alright, we don't care for American sportscars. Top Gear are always critical of Detroit's offerings as they're usually based on out-of-date technology that Europeans and Japanese manufacturers had moved away from, particularly chassis which have a massive effect on handling. But then, we have fewer straight roads, so handling is more important here than raw power. [Exception: for some reason, Top Gear seems to be in love with the Ford GT.] P.S. Is your first language English? Can't follow the meaning of your second post. It needs more prepositions and punctuation.
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 04:55 pm Matt Patton is from Houston?? Damn it...
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 05:40 pm Welcome to the New Wrold Order! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CWBTL33MpA
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 06:16 pm Well....... Brits drive on the wrong side of the road!!!!!!!! And, they eat disgusting stuff. Research 'Black Pudding'. I rest my case. :P
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 10:11 pm @Lorelei: "And, they eat disgusting stuff. Research 'Black Pudding'." I can do no better than quote the quotable Stephen Fry, "This from a country which makes spray-on cheese!"
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 10:51 pm ROFL Got to admit Jan, Skander's got a point And, just because left is the opposite of right, doesn't mean it's wrong. LOL Hugs and respect Jo
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:42 pm Fine. Marmalade. I detest marmalade. Who wants rinds and pulp in their jam?
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| Friday, August 12, 2011 - 11:46 pm ahhh back to the good ol days...sat at my grans eating tripe and onions, mmmm ;P
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 01:32 am Back to the topic, I live in Australia, which has some of the strictest gun control in the world. Homicide rates here are lower than in the US, far lower in fact. I honestly do not see the logic in saying that the more guns, the safer the community. Us Australians used to be the same as the US- gun lovers at heart- but then one morning in Tasmania some nut went around and massacred a few dozen people, and we decided to give them up for the greater good. Now look at us- crime rates are lower than ever, we don't need to lock our doors at night (although I still do) and the police have scrapped guns for tasers because there is no real need for so much firepower. There is a direct correlation between the number of guns in a country and the homicide rate. The less guns=the safer the community. Thats why the US has a homicide rate higher than any other developed nation in the world. That is why there are more people in America's prisons than there are in the whole of Australia. If America wants to be "great" again, it needs to: a)educate its people. b)make the process of attaining a gun a much harder process. Now, I'm going to sit here and watch all the gun-lovers swarm over this forum denouncing and claiming that guns are the answer to all of the world's problems. Wasn't it guns which killed people in WW2? Wasn't it a gun which shot JFK/ Martin Luther King? Wasn't it a gun that killed dozens of people in a Virginian University. That sort of loss-of-life is non-existant here because of one thing- the restriction of guns in the general community. T
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 04:06 am lol and what pray tell is wrong wif cheese in a spray can???? i think it rather brilliant. :P and omg Blue....... dun u dare get any of those ideas when you cook MY meals!!!! I will never get over black pudding. I'm scarred for life! And I thought Oxy's use of saran wrap was traumatizing!!! (Oxy = WhiteDarkness)
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 08:49 am Blame everything on guns Cuz it wasn't our government that killed JFK it wasn't a crazy lone gun man. Who had really good aim with a crappy rifle. A crazy person can always get a gun off the streets. If a criminal really wants a gun they don't walk into a gun store, wait 2 weeks, and then go on a killing spree. Guns in the wrong hands is the problem. The government makes money off the sales of arms. I mean look a US government agency in charge of protecting US citizens sold guns to a Mexican drug cartel. And all they say is Yes we fu*%ed up. Without guns the people can't protect themselfs,the criminals would still kill people,and the government would tell you to shut the ?uck up. Freedom isn't free all the soldiers that died for this great country are rolling over in their graves. Did u not listen to the JFK post. Go back listen to it until u hear him say an announced need for security. Listen to his words. They are trying to disarm us,to control us,to rely on them for everything. Wendy is right the real WW3 will be fought between the people and govt. When u people wake up it will be to late for you. Yes u may say Wendy is crazy,smokes your nuts. My response would be I Hope I am nuts and this $hit won't go down. Google Georgia guide stones. Reduce world population to 500m. Guns aren't the problem its the ignorant people sitting there while the world goes to HELL. Rant over. One last thing Tom the government makes the guns not people like u and me. They gave them to us it wasn't our choice. Now they wanna take them away along with you. But they will still have guns. They will never give up their guns. Face it no matter who has the guns and weather u hear about the murders they still happen. Just in secret. Away from the public eye. Cough Nazi America cough.
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 10:07 am You're dillusional. Saying that having a gun will protect you is rubbish. Saying that people will win a war against their own government with guns (at least in the developed world) is rubbish. There is a thing called peaceful protest. Also, ever wondered what that crazy person who went around shooting people would have done had he not had access to a gun. My country has survived without guns, even when there are three huge and overly populated countries (*cough* Indonisia *cough* India *cough* China) eyeing off our huge natural resources and open fields (I live in Australia, which happens to have a low crime rate thanks to stricter gun control- thank god.) Yes, things happen that we don't see which are horrendous, awful. The fact is however that the world governments/illuminati/alien infiltrators (whatever you believe in) aren't out to kill you, the US, Australia, and Europe are not the super-secretive autocratic regimes Hollywood has made them out to be. You said that ignorant people is the reason the world is going to sh*t. You are partially correct. It is also because nutjobs are allowed to gain too much power without gaining responsibility. Giving a redneck a gun will not help anyone. Hitler was given too much power- tens of lives and 2 atomic bombs later we realised our mistake. The fact is that Europe/Australia has survived without guns and their countries haven't become regimes. The world is not full of evil people. Only a few thousand named Al-Qaeda who inspire fear through their crazy actions. Ever since 9/11, people have become more and more insensitive and oblivious to change- Americans have stuck to their guns while their country implodes socially, politically and economically, while the world has watched, stunned, as a culture alienates itself. Hollywood has inspired the uneducated masses that guns are good as they protect people from other people wishing to do harm, while the truth is that the less guns there are in a society, the better it is. No one has a chance to defend themselves if they are shot through the head. I await your denial and denouncing of my statement.
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 05:29 pm Tom Morgan, I am very pro gun as it pertains to a person's right to self defend. For you to say to believe in such is delusional is very wrong of you. I promise you this....every criminal will have access to a gun whether it is legal or no. So us law abiding citizens who don't because it is the law, let's say, will stand there protectionless????? Is that right? Rubbish, I say. I'm the daughter of law enforcement... you ask a police officer their thoughts on the topic. Having said this, I am not in favor of violent protests. But I promise you this, it is the 'riff raff' who do so. Your decent person and law abiding citizen wouldn't behave in such a mannerism. You call me delusional, I'll nuke ya or have ya nuked! How u like them apples? :P
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 06:30 pm Hey lori dont steel my line, how do u like them apples i already said something loke that somewhere on this thread.
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 07:36 pm I wonder how many of you have actually fired a side arm in civilian life. And how accurate you would be, and if you think you could actually shoot a living person? Interesting statistic #1: 57% of ALL deaths by firearms are Suicide. USGO 2010
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 07:46 pm I was just informed that baked beans are a staple wif scrambled eggs and toast over there in the UK!!!!! OMG it gets even worse! Let's not even go there with the Brown Sauce!
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 07:47 pm Yep, and bubble and squeak, mmmmm, bubble...
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 07:50 pm Crafty i go to the gun range every so often, my aim is so good i could hit the red dot on the paper dargets they give me, it could be becuase i have a scope on every gun i own.
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 07:57 pm Nice Q, but the point I was trying to get across is IF you could pull the trigger, IF you could hit target under the stress of defending yourself, and IF the round would have the desired effect. All this shite you see on tele/film of double handed shooting with gun sideways, diving behind gypsum walls, come on...
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| Saturday, August 13, 2011 - 11:39 pm An interesting thread. @Jo: "Nothing is ever black and white." Nothing? Ever? Isn't that pretty absolutist, dogmatic, and extreme? "Most things aren't black and white" doesn't have that same ring of certainty, though. @Wendy: I can't believe I agree with you on a social issue. You're not one of those returned players playing dress-up, are you? @Smokes: Man, I'm impressed! I wish I could be in your fed. @Skandar: What makes Breivik a Christian? The fact that he was born in Norway? Why not just say that Norwegians can do good or bad, and call him a Scandinavian nut, instead of bringing your religious prejudices into it? @Billy Bob etc: It's not the Republicans who are keeping people stupid. The large US cities with the worst education problems are almost invariably one-party Democrat towns, with Democrats running the school systems from top to bottom, and have been for decades. @Tom Morgan: "Saying that people will win a war against their own government with guns (at least in the developed world) is rubbish." The philosophy behind the 2nd amendment is that we trust our fellow citizens as much as we trust the government, which is composed of some citizens who we allow some powers. There are irresponsible people in government as well as out. Ever wonder who keeps the US military in check? Capitalists, liberals with loud voices, and rednecks with guns. Yes, I'm overstating the point (nothing is ever black and white) but there's a lot of truth to it.
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| Sunday, August 14, 2011 - 12:44 am LOL Jojo. Ok, I'll amend my statement to read: nothing is ever black and white, other than those things that are clearly black and / or white. However, this isn't one of them Smokes: guns don't kill people. People kill people. However, people with guns find it easier to kill people than those without. If people find it more difficult (please note, I don't say 'impossible') to get guns, then it's more difficult to kill people with them. That doesn't mean they can't use other weapons, and we have an acknowledged problem here in the UK with knife crime. However, we do have fewer shootings here in the UK (and presumably Australia, Tom) than in the US. That's fewer shootings by civilians, and fewer shootings by police. However you look at it, the stats speak for themselves. Sidenote: In the UK there is an ancient law that requires every citizen to own a bow and to attend archery practice once a week. They never got around to repealing it, and sometimes I wonder what would happen if the police ever tried to enforce it ... Back to the topic in hand. Don't get me wrong, I admire the US constitutional right to bear arms, if only because it allows the populace to rise against an oppressive government, should one ever occur. But in a largely democratic and constitutional society, where one hopes that would never happen, violence breeds violence. And, god forbid, it ever did, give me Ghandi over Mandela every time. Hugs and respect Jo
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| Sunday, August 14, 2011 - 01:03 am What I was trying to say about never winning a war against a government in the first world with guns is that you try and take on the US Government with a pistol. You would lose. The Right to Bear Arms was an amendment to scare away the British and in today's society, its pretty useless. Keeping the army in check by having guns in the civil population is an argument I cannot understand. The army has grenades, and missiles and tanks, of which a shotgun is useless against. Any rogue military force with fire power and training will easily defeat a farmer with a shotgun. Probably just as quicky as a British or Australian farmer with a pitch fork. Back in the 19th Century, it would have been far easier to fight against the army because everyone had the same weaponry. Today you don't see ordinary people flying Fighter Jets or using Missile Batteries. The army has far more power than any of you. If there was an oppresive government in the US, it would put down any resistance quicker than anyone could blink. One bomb can erase an entire city in virtually 2 seconds, without any of the attacking force being wounded. The fact is that the governments of the free world have armies which are (hopefully) under control (for now, anyway). I know I have been a little over-the-top crazy- I just believe there is little reason to have so many guns so freely avaliable in a society which doesn't need them. Yes, there will always be a black market for guns, but limiting the over-the-counter avaliability of guns at least goes some way into cutting crime rates.
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| Sunday, August 14, 2011 - 01:21 am Hey, I have an idea! You can have all the guns you want, but having ammo is punishable by death.
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| Sunday, August 14, 2011 - 10:12 am @Jojo T. Hun Anders Breivik wanted to roll back the tide of multiculturalism in Europe, he feared the islamification of Europe and wanted to preserve a Christian Europe. His manifesto stated that he was "100 percent Christian" and a "modern-day crusader". He posted a picture of himself dressed as a Knight Templar officer (a medieval military Christian order). My aim in bringing up Anders Breivik, was not to score points against religion. I simply wanted to point out that when a member of ANY group (religious, geographical, demographical) is involved in unsavoury acts, the remainder of the group is usually very quick in denouncing them as not a "true" X. I think it would be far better to accept that there are members of EVERY group that harbour slightly more extreme views than the average and encourage the group to challenge their views. This is far less likely to result in nutters going out & bombing/shooting people. It also means that the group can point to their attempts at debating & challenging views as evidence that the nutter was not actually a "true" X, rather than simply denouncing them ex post facto.
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| Sunday, August 14, 2011 - 07:37 pm Skandar, I agree with your main points. I'm really objecting to your calling him a "religious nut". Searching on "was breivik a christian" I see some more quotes from his manifesto, where he claims he's "moderately religious", "not an excessively religious man", and that "I'm not going to pretend I'm a very religious person". So why not call him a "not very religious nut"? He says he wants "a secular European society based on our Christian cultural heritage". I can see calling him a Christian in the cultural sense, but not a Christian in the religious sense. So how about calling him a "cultural nut"? In fact, unless you strongly identify as a cultural or religious Christian yourself, and thus are trying to assume blame for the guy, it seems that you're doing pretty much what you're blaming other groups for: disassociating yourself from the nut and pawning him off on others! Anyway, I'm not European but as an American am part of the "Christian cultural heritage" he's talking about, so I'll accept some responsibility and advise anyone here and elsewhere not to descend into complete moral depravity, not to mention hypocricy and utter stupidity, to try to achieve your goals of preserving the valuable parts of it.
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 03:09 am so um what do we hunt with a bow for my company onjly the sups and managers can touch the guns sorry female sups I can't help you I misloades firearm = termination yes US loves guns now there is the assault tommy BB gun the assault AK47 BB gun all available at Acad sports
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 03:27 am Tom called me dillusional...LMFAO... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8 >>>JFK Secret service stand down... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHUKPXR5TbQ >>>Death Bed confession that CIA did it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO24XmP1c5E&ob=av3e >>>NWO information http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pkk4sMsHpdo >>>Gun control http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71aXlW4gFcg >>>>9/11 false flag attacks http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xirs6VKcTUU&feature=related >>>>The Rise of FEMA Look I could go on forever with these links...What you call 3 conspiracies is really just one BIG ONE! Its not about East or West. What color your skin is. what country your from. Or What religion you belong to. Its about control. No guns means easily controlled. Thats what i'm saying. I leave you with this Song>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1T8xgHdMEM
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 03:29 am Oh and that a$$hole that went on that shooting spree in Norway was a freemason.
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 05:44 am LoL Jojo long time no see.... its me Hun.
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 06:00 am I think total prohib on all guns would be bad as in beer prohib bad which did not last long but prohib on military grad weapons yes but BB assault is an alternative for those who like full auto and single shot hunting rifles but yeah selling full auto regular bad idea if they do get a full auto it is on the black market like dope
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 07:21 am Alcohol prohibition lasted for years, no? In fact, here's a shiny new wikipedia article which tells you all you need to know.
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 07:51 am and it was about the same time as the Great depression Americans like their booze guns and big vehicles or cars with big block v8 I don't know how many times I've seen a humvee in a movie probably the most popular vehicle in a movie but recectly discontinued
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 08:04 am What's your point?
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| Monday, August 15, 2011 - 10:27 pm don't take away the alcohol, the guns or the v8 cars n trucks even though so may get discontinued and come back latter like the Charger even the Aussie cars are American based they have US engines and are built like a US muscle car like some have the corvette engine
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 01:19 am Are you an... IT, Patton? I'll have to call the IT especialist Lorelei to be certain.
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 03:08 am no I'm a mlw who works for a company that sells guns I can touch the ammo and the BB guns but can't touch the real ones
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 04:26 am Laguna, I got a telepathic message from you that you needed my expertise opinion on a matter..... It brought me right here! I have evaluated. Matt Patton has passed wif flying colors all the indicators for definite 'IT-dom'. lol
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 02:06 pm This is most serious. We have to advance in our efforts to control and annihilate thw IT infection. We must stop their propagation before it is too late!
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 09:53 pm Oh yes! A MUST! What to do???? What to do????
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| Tuesday, August 16, 2011 - 10:46 pm Hit the IT!
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| Saturday, April 7, 2012 - 09:36 pm Hmmmm, I havent heard from the ITs for a while. Good job Laguna and lorlei.
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| Sunday, April 8, 2012 - 05:11 pm I managed to find their nests and blast all of the eggs with nukes. It was gorgeous.
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| Sunday, April 8, 2012 - 06:49 pm With every responsible person there is a irresponsible one. Surly a responsible person should, by now, realize that forsaking their own individual rights to stop a mad yank in their V8 packing a gun while drinking Vodka is worth it. I'm sure that if any of you had lost a family member to a mad, gun toting, Vodka drinking V8 driving Yank, you wouldn't be so keen on keeping your gun rights........Surly? As for the riots............We ain't seen nothing yet Crafty! Capitalism has destroyed the fabric of our societies. And do you think the captains of capitalism care? Nope. They have their bolt holes and helicopters. To them, the destruction of society will only lead to greater opportunities.
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