| rep (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 01:42 am 
Just finished reading it, and found it interesting (although I'm not clear on where the "net worker profit" fits in).
Two questions:
(1)Even back in '08 the big debate was to run your corps supply level at 160 or 190. Has anyone done a definitive study on this to decide one way or the other? I understand the ASQ formula and all; I'm just interested in hearing from anyone who's done it both ways and if so, which worked better.
(2)In the guide portion of IPOing, she recommends having your CEO buy your IPO on the "15%/30%" formula until the CEO has 100%. The question is does this impact the max corp limit your CEO can put in your country?
As always, thanks in advance for any info. |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 02:52 am
#2: Yes. If you're at 11 corps and IPO one over. You just hit 12. Stops you from building, or moving one in, but go ahead and shift another one over.
#1: what do you mean exactly? |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 03:50 am
WD,
My first time around, the members of the Fed I was in on GR believed that if you ran your corp supply at 160Q it was the most profitable way. Wildeyes (and others back then)swore that 190Q supply was what you needed to be the most profitable. I was just wondering who was right.
I did good economically on GR using the 160Q, and I haven't been around long enough this time to try to experiment. Right now I'm using 160Q, and my corps are not gangbusters, but they're doing well enough (except that stupid fruit juice corp that was there when I started, and NOTHING will help a FJ corp! Some things don't change, cocoa and fruit juice are bad news for profits now just like they used to be.)
Anyway, thanks for the answer on the IPO thing. |
| Synicus (White Giant) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 05:28 am
(1) I've been looking at 165 and 185. Test it and keep us posted.  Anyways, a country is more fickle than an enterprise and enterprises often order low quality FMU and energy. I'd go with the lower rate for country and the higher one for an enterprise.
(2) ? I don't know about the 100% part or what white darkness said. It doesn't stop your enterprise from controlling more public corps in your country, for example my enterprise controlls 35 corps in my main. If they remain public, they also don't count tward the enterprises maximum 750 corps. |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 09:02 am
Synicus,
Thanks. Makes sense to me about the difference between countries and CEOs. Maybe that's where the debate comes from, the 190Q people looking at it as CEOs, the 160Qs as countries. In about a thousand game years I'll get back to you, after I become the Warren Buffet of LU!
For those not familiar, Buffet is one major rich investor here in the U.S.
The 100% ownership bothers me too. Were things different when Wildeyes wrote it up, I wonder? If either the CEO or the country own more than 25% they lose the bonus for being true public, correct?
While I'm on it, one more quick one. My state corps are paying me 80% profit transfer, which I will lose of course if I IPO them to my CEO. And since I can't put cash into them after going public I'm not going to want to pay a dividend transfer of more than 10% until I build up the corps' cash reserve. The question is whether what I gain in production and "country resources used" will be close to equal to that 80% profit transfer?
I'm only running a monthly surplus of 25-30B per month right now, if going public will bring in less cash I'd prefer to wait.
Need to take lessons on how to write SHORT posts! Cheesh.
Anyhow, thanks for the input folks. Been some changes, with more to come! |
| Synicus (White Giant) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 10:10 am
Correct, the guide author should avoid stearing the reader into risk.
Going Public will bring in cash at the cost of income. Once the CEO gains control your income will increase more than the 80% state transfer assuming the p/e is still low. |
| Crafty (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 11:59 am
Tax them suckers at 75%, after all, they're yours. Good corps will gain the cash quite rapidly and your country will reap as much if not more. I look at the enterprise as a tool more than an individual money making entity. |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 09:15 pm
Synicus,
Thank you. Perhaps the guide needs updated to meet the new rules.
Crafty,
If I could tax industry by industry I'd consider it, but it's all or none here and I won't do that to the CEOs in my country. Besides that, being a conservative, high taxes are the work of the devil! :D
Agree with your assessment of enterprises. Mine is there so that I can get access to corps my level (4) can't, and to supply me with strategic reserves. Not to mention as a storage depot for the weapons I'll need when I go out to take on a nasty c3! Although, if it turns into a moneymaker, there's cash to transfer if my country needs it.
Well, with what I've read here I think my midrange goals are much clearer. Thanks all. |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 09:57 pm
Going back to #2, she was talking at that time about total change of ownership, not leaving the corp public. That however is not what your core thrust was at.
If you have 11 corps from your enterprise in the country and you shift one over, it counts for both caps. However, nothing prevents you from shifting another one over.
If you've got 750 CEO corporations in an enterprise, you can continue to acquire and completely control them via IPO. A little work and suddenly you have 800.
I'm assuming on #1 you're referring to how everyone sets an supply quality target for a corporation at 160 or whatever? |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 10:18 pm
WD,
Correct. Used to be the limit was 6 on CEO corps, glad it's been bumped.
LOL on the 750 corps. Just started the CEO about 10 days ago, so I'm at 40 right now. But given time...
That's also correct on the supply thing.
Back to (2) I assume then that there is a benefit to having your CEO own your state corps? I'm trying to figure what that would be. I realize the increased production, but it's taking away the 80% PT from income and putting the money in the CEOs pocket. Unless I tax at 75%, which I just cannot do in good conscience. Do private corps pay country resources then? |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 8, 2011 - 11:21 pm
6 corps per any country but yours. Your countries are 12.
Advantages of transitioning them over. 1. Private corporations and enterprise controlled publics are mostly invulnerable. You don't have to defend them, their only vulnerability is to catastrophic damage (earthquakes, nukes in the area).
The money, well, it's all yours. Keep in mind, an enterprise corp is "blessed" to pay it's resident country about 40% of turnover. So another 40% may wander over to your CEO, but once you break that 2T mark, you can just siphon the money out and put it where you want.
Heh, on the supplies. I use a flat 100, with controlled exceptions via contract. I don't like wasting money. |
| Kitsuné (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 9, 2011 - 12:48 am
Private corporations also have more upgrades and much lower property cost.
Looking at two oil corps of mine in the same country, one is state and the other private.
State corp pays 914.07M SC$/month in property cost.
Private corp pays 212.43M SC$/month in property cost.
Savings of $700M per month...
Don't worry about the loss of profit transfer. 40% of turnover (sales) from a private corporation is almost always equal to or greater than 80% of profit from a state corporation. |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 9, 2011 - 01:43 am
Ah, the joys of having a bunch of intelligent people to discuss things with.
And the thing that's strange is that even though there are a lot of different theories here, all of them make sense.
WD, since I'm only in one (already invulnerable due to the new war rules)country right now the part about not having to defend them isn't important. BUT when I snatch a c3 it will become VERY important. On the 100 supplies, I do the same thing with selected corps, those that are my country suppliers. You don't like wasting money; me, I'm just cheap! :P
Kitsune,
Thanks for those numbers. I've wondered how they figured what the country resources were. And the property cost difference is an eye opener. Guess the state corps have to pay for all the local corrupt politicians.
Now I can only hope Tom doesn't rush through his idea about making the mining corps "run out " of resources! Two oil, a gold, a potassium, and a coal corp in my country. The pollution sucks but I pay a decent salary so the peeps are happy! |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 9, 2011 - 03:08 am
If I was doing country suppliers, I wouldn't even upgrade quality. An additiona waste of money.
Most corporations, I can fully upgrade, then hit the quality cap with 1-3 supply contracts at 200 quality. Getting, 296, 333, 370Q from maybe supplying that 300K units of services for 200% of market price versus buying everything at 180% of market price? Which is cheaper? |
| rep (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 9, 2011 - 03:56 am
Right again. I do only efficiency upgrades on my country boys. Q upgrades on them worthless.
I guess it all comes down to what function you want your corp to perform and what your long term goals for it are. Sort of like a sports team with your stars, your regulars, and your fill ins. |
| The Walking Glitch (Little Upsilon) | Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 09:36 am
he left? |
| white darkness (Little Upsilon) | Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 07:57 pm
She had. That guide was written years back. Left and returned. A lot of us do that. |
| Kitsuné | Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 10:19 pm
Someone named WildEyes quit the game. Not too long after, BrokenAmbitions changed her name to WildEyes.
The notion that these two are the same person is something I am unlikely to ever accept. |
| Blueserpent (Fearless Blue) | Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 11:03 pm
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