| Darke Katt (Fearless Blue) | Monday, June 8, 2009 - 08:24 pm 
Welcome to part two.
What if...
What if the British had granted the Thirteen Colonies representation in parliament? What if the American Revolution had never happened?
Discuss. |
| The High Profitess (Golden Rainbow) | Monday, June 8, 2009 - 09:26 pm
We would have PwneD England thru parliament, as we had to in the war.
Cup 0' Tea? |
| Vincent22 | Tuesday, June 9, 2009 - 03:41 am
we still would have revolted to far away to ever get to a vote on time and we would have been out voted anyway (we never wanted to be a part of their parliament)
if we were a part of parliament back then their be no united states of america. it would proboly be a bunch of different countrys here. and no electricity or computer or ways of mass communication that we have today. |
| Pope Samtator IX | Tuesday, June 9, 2009 - 04:45 am
The Republic of Texas would have invaded in 1837... |
| Darke Katt | Tuesday, June 9, 2009 - 06:03 am
Quote:we still would have revolted to far away to ever get to a vote on time and we would have been out voted anyway (we never wanted to be a part of their parliament)
The American colonies were relatively close compared to other parts of the British Empire. So this assessment is somewhat erroneous.
And the whole revolution was over taxation without representation, so this becomes a moot point anyway.
Quote:and no electricity or computer or ways of mass communication that we have today.
None of those are American discoveries/inventions.
Electricity was loosely known about since about 2700BC, and effectively "discovered" in 1600 by William Gilbert.
The "computer" was invented in 1837 by Charles Babbage. Computer Science (mod) itself can be attributed to Alan Turing.
"Mass communication" such as the telephone, tv and radio were invented by Alexander Graham Bell, John Logie Baird and Jagadish Chandra Bose respectively.
Back to the point at hand, I think its likely that the current US would have existed in much the same way as Canada or Australia did. The obvious ramification of this being that the North American continent would have one very large nation where two exist today.
Relations would have been far less combative. There would've been no war of 1812.
Of course, there may well have been none of the subsequent land purchases and invasive measures which gave the US its current girth. It is even possible that several nations could exist where the US currently does, some of Native American origin, perhaps even French and Spanish. |
| Pluto (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, June 10, 2009 - 01:21 am
It is Almost Possible to Suggest also that if the American Colonialists were granted representation, then we could be Under Anglo-american governermentship today , or possibly around the 18 th century, although it is also possible another French/Indian war saw by the actual colonialists could of come to fruition , |
| Vincent22 (White Giant) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 03:51 am
first of all the revolution wasnt just about taxes read the bill of rights.
second electricity was created and harnessed by Thomas Edison. and sold and mass prodused by him in the free capitalistic market of america all of those invetions couldnt be made with out him. american industrys mass produce all those products. makeing them cheap to buy for every one also the united states government subsidize most of those industry for defence and communications of a very large country
thrid and how can you say relasions would be less comative. why wouldnt english french and spanish fight for the untaped resourse of the rest of america? throw in the native americans and all of the immagrents(alltho they could have died or change their homeland) add slaves the melting pot of america would be a blood bath |
| Kiteless (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 07:22 am
Quote:second electricity was created and harnessed by Thomas Edison. and sold and mass prodused by him in the free capitalistic market of america all of those invetions couldnt be made with out him. american industrys mass produce all those products. makeing them cheap to buy for every one also the united states government subsidize most of those industry for defence and communications of a very large country
Benjamin Franklin, Alessandro Volta and Michael Faraday had all successfully experimented with electricity in different ways long before Thomas Edison invented the light bulb. |
| IndustMech (White Giant) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 11:03 am
Tesla invented 3 Phase AC.
And a way to transmit electicity wirelessly.
And the vibrator. |
| Pope Samtator IX (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 05:59 pm
Tesla made modern life possible.
Not only did he discover alternating current he also designed the electromagnetic motor and necessary components to use his discovery.
His patents cover most of what makes the modern world function.
He was perhaps the single most gifted engineering mind the world has ever known. |
| Darke Katt (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 07:36 pm
Quote:first of all the revolution wasnt just about taxes read the bill of rights.
The Bill or Rights does nothing more than place many age-old concepts of English Common Law into a written document. Their precedents predate America by many hundreds of years.
The colonies began their revolt against the crown over high taxes without the right to representation.
Quote:second electricity was created and harnessed by Thomas Edison. and sold and mass prodused by him in the free capitalistic market of america all of those invetions couldnt be made with out him. american industrys mass produce all those products. makeing them cheap to buy for every one also the united states government subsidize most of those industry for defence and communications of a very large country
Firstly, electricity cannot be created as such. Electrical current is, at its simplest, a waveform flow through a "sea" of electrons. It is converted from stored potentials. Trust me on this; I'm a physicist.
Mass production was spread around the world by the British Empire. See Industrial Revolution.
Edison invented many things. Electricity is not one of them.
Quote:thrid and how can you say relasions would be less comative. why wouldnt english french and spanish fight for the untaped resourse of the rest of america? throw in the native americans and all of the immagrents(alltho they could have died or change their homeland) add slaves the melting pot of america would be a blood bath
Relations between the British and the colonists would have been less compative, simply because America would have remained a British Dominion - a part of the Empire. Canada and Australia both offer excellent examples of positive relationships between colonies and the UK.
The Spanish surrendered their claims to North America as their power waned. So it is unlikely the Spanish themselves would have laid claim to the lands. Maybe Mexico, as happened in actual history.
The French more or less gave up their claims in favour of European domination. See Napoleonic Wars.
The only nation capable (at the time) of holding possession of North America (Assuming the revolution had not happened) would have been the British. And, as the westward expansion demonstrated, the British did have at least some capacity for getting along with the natives.
As it stood, America was a bloodbath - equal in scale to Europe. There was racism, holy wars, genocide and murder.
But that is human nature at its worst. |
| 117000 (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 08:32 pm
The American Revolution did inspire other revolutions in which a democratic or a republican government was setup with the peoples' rights in mind. |
| BorderC (Little Upsilon) | Thursday, June 11, 2009 - 09:12 pm
Okay, okay. We get it. The British Empire was important 200 or 300 years ago!
Sheesh!
:P |
| Vincent22 (White Giant) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:17 am
the british empire was importaint but the fall of it was more important. most empires dont like change. like the napolianic wars and ect.
Edison is the grandfather of electrcity. he wasnt a scientist or buissnessman like everyone else mentioned. he dropped out of grammer school to work in a trainyard and eventually invented an entire industry selling power and uses for it. also tesla work for him
so i dont think you could say anyone else would of done it or even say he would have done everthing the same way in a british controlled colony if he still could have born (no dout american societ wold have been very different by then and its very possable his ancetorse would have been different, married other people, been killed moved somewhere eles, ect.)
therefore no electricity and every thing that comes withit |
| BorderC (Little Upsilon) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:37 am
I read somewhere or saw a documentary about how Edison stole all of Tesla's ideas. Tesla was had a lot of social issues, or something like that. |
| Kiteless (Little Upsilon) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:46 am
Quote:Edison is the grandfather of electrcity. he wasnt a scientist or buissnessman like everyone else mentioned. he dropped out of grammer school to work in a trainyard and eventually invented an entire industry selling power and uses for it. also tesla work for him
1600 - English physician William Gilbert coins the term "electric" from the Greek word "elektron".
1752 - Benjamin Franklin performs his famous experiment in which he flies a kite during a thunderstorm, thus demonstrating the link between electricity and lightning.
1800 - Italian-born physicist Alessandro Volta creates the voltaic pile, later to become more commonly known as the electric battery; the first ever device to produce a steady electric current.
1831 - English scientist Michael Faraday creates the electric dynamo.
1847 - Thomas Edison born in Milan, Ohio, USA.
This timeline of events hardly makes Thomas Edison the "Grandfather" of electricity. Edison clearly made a large contribution to the industry as a whole, but he merely marketed and sold a product that others had previously worked with and also derived success from. |
| Vincent22 (White Giant) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:57 am
thats all samantics hes the one who made it practical |
| Petra Arkanian (White Giant) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:59 am
First of all, sEmantics...
second...
se·man·tics Listen to the pronunciation of semantics
Pronunciation:
\si-ˈman-tiks\
Function:
noun plural but singular or plural in construction
Date:
1893
1: the study of meanings: a: the historical and psychological study and the classification of changes in the signification of words or forms viewed as factors in linguistic development b (1): semiotic (2): a branch of semiotic dealing with the relations between signs and what they refer to and including theories of denotation, extension, naming, and truth 2: general semantics3 a: the meaning or relationship of meanings of a sign or set of signs ; especially : connotative meaning b: the language used (as in advertising or political propaganda) to achieve a desired effect on an audience especially through the use of words with novel or dual meanings
that's from webster. Or if you prefer the ever-popular dictionary.com...
seâ‹…manâ‹…tics
  /sɪˈmæntɪks/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [si-man-tiks] Show IPA
–noun (used with a singular verb)
1. Linguistics.
a. the study of meaning.
b. the study of linguistic development by classifying and examining changes in meaning and form.
2. Also called significs. the branch of semiotics dealing with the relations between signs and what they denote.
3. the meaning, or an interpretation of the meaning, of a word, sign, sentence, etc.: Let's not argue about semantics.
4. general semantics.
You have not been correct for this ENTIRE thread, Vincent. Not once. Stop being an idiot, for it annoys Wild. |
| Pope Samtator IX | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 02:12 am
Edison discovered Direct Current. Useful for batteries and low voltage. Not useful for high voltages or long distance transmission.
Tesla discovered Alternating Current which is what we use in modern electric transmission.
He held over 100 patents around the world covering a wide range of products.
His notes were confiscated by the US government upon his death mainly due to his research into resonance and long range wireless transmission of electricity.
Edison had a good press agent. |
| Vincent22 (White Giant) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 02:24 am
But tesla work for edison's company so would he have discover without his equipment and funding or would he have worked on something eles.
and for all the english teachers
phukc ,u as'wholes |
| Petra Arkanian (Little Upsilon) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 02:37 am
English is actually for everyone who speaks english.
And you have no evidence for thinking Tesla would have been SOL without Edison.
And why do you seem to be suggesting Edison would not have been around had we stayed British colonies? No United States doesn't mean North America (or a portion of it) got wiped off the face of the planet. Edison wouldn't have been able to come up with his patents if he had been a British citizen or colonial?
You're still an idiot and have not ceased being one, as I requested.
Edit: Nice edit. I'm keeping my post as it is to remind me of your further idiocy... "english is for english teachers" indeed. Dimwit. |
| Vincent22 (White Giant) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 04:55 am
tesla work for edison as a scientist where he came up with ac current. and considering he died poor regardless he wouldnt be able to fund his reserch and labratory without edison.
im not say edison couldnt exsist im saying that all of the factor leading up to his life and work wouldbe dramaticly change. mainly because the british colonys would be ran diferently the american ran it and also all the people who were to die in the revolutionary war would still be living and no dout change the society. they marry they would work eat live ect.ect.ect. that would have somesort of affect on edisons ancestors and there disions and edisons life. which would change what he does.
petra your a CUNT
not because you called me an idiot or critisied my crapy grammer its because you copied and pasted some long dumb post of how iwas wrong and annoy you. all you have to do is tell me what was wrong and how to correct it and i would. till then quit acting like a pompus cunt |
| Petra Arkanian (Little Upsilon) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 05:48 am
I somehow don't think you're qualified to conjecture about such fine nuances of an alternate timeline.
You don't know how dramatically his life would have changed, nor do you know anything about what effects would be caused from the casualties in the Revolution living instead of dying.
You obviously don't know anything about the history of electricity, based upon the overwhelming evidence presented by other parties in this thread.
Nor do you allow room for the chance that another Edison might emerge. Someone would do what he did eventually... or if we're playing around with conjectures about alternate timelines... well, maybe without the strife and growing pains after the Revolution, the colonies would have developed more quickly! Then we would have had electricity sooner and the world would be BETTER! You have no weight behind your claims. They're not even intelligent conjecture. It's rubbish, the lot of it.
You have detracted from and derailed a thread which I was interested in watching develop and you have therefore annoyed me. Come to LU. I have need of a new plaything.
What about George Westinghouse? He was an electrical pioneer at the same time as Edison... another proportional of AC current.... which is what we use now, NOT the DC that Edison backed. As a matter of fact, it was Westinghouse who BEAT Edison in the fight to determine the electrical distribution system that we use today. Has anyone mentioned AC and DC yet??! /sarcasm....
In no way shape or form is today's technological society dependent on Thomas Edison's existence. He is an accidental figure in the greater scheme of things. |
| Darke Katt (Little Upsilon) | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 01:44 pm
I'd also like for us to consider the ramifications for other parts of the world had Britain and the US remained part of the same entity.
How would the various wars (Napoleonic, 19th century) have gone differently if the combined resources had been present from the very beginning? |
| BorderC | Friday, June 12, 2009 - 03:49 pm
Hard to say since so many of America's leaders at the time were Francophiles. The Napoleonic Wars may have pushed America closer to independence.
But, if the US became independent 20 or 30 years later it wouldn't have had the uniting figure of Washington, the genius of Hamilton, and people like Madison may have never had the chance to take part in writing the Constitution.
So, we could have had a much different outcome on our side of the Atlantic. |
