| Treasurer (White Giant) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 04:03 am 
Well the whatever the GM's did, country profits are taking the worst hit, especially if they are CEO based economies. If CEO corps cannot be paid for their products that they sell with the quality multiplier, those corps are only getting a pittance in profit AND only when run with low salaries and full hiring. Low salaries will also effect the finance index of the countries they reside in a negative manner.
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Also notice how they singlehandedly ruined the coin market by offering coins when they are not in demand, thus driving down the demand for them even further. They offer 470b per coin when you try to sell, yet when you attempt to buy from them, they only sell at a minimum rate of 550b, thus guaranteeing they make a profit off of our need. It isn't enough that they drove down profitability of corps, countries, and CEOs. Now they have driven down the cash market.
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They have also taken steps to reduce economic minded players chances to turn a well run private corporation into a public one by decreasing the allowable cash in the corp without reducing the minimum requirements in order to perform IPO's. For those of you who do not know what an IPO is, it is when you take a corporation public and offer shares out onto the share market. Public corporation numbers are in a steep decline now as a result.
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I am watching the numbers of corps that are failing and countries being closed by active presidents. The numbers are growing daily. I have it on several different player's words that several emails are not being answered by the Gamemasters pertaining these events over the last 2 months. I for one have stopped emailing them because even though I have been very respectful in my EMAILS to them, my banter and public disapproval on these forums has driven them to ignore any communications from me.
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So, it falls on each and every one of you active players that take delight in this game, to stand up and let your voice be heard in a respectful manner, so that they might come to their senses and try to alleviate some of the pains we are all going through with these changes. I hope they will listen, but have been around long enough to know that the clock moves extra slow in Amsterdam. I have come to accept that fact. They have a small crew and do not always think about ALL the ramifications of their decisions before they enact new changes.
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They are determined to drive up interest in the game by advertising and making the game more attractive to the new players that try it out. I stand behind them in that. But I want us all to remind them to not forget about the ones that have been loyal to them through the years and haven't left them for greener pastures.
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Players, please do not give up and leave the game. We have been through major changes before and they will most assuredly continue. This game is a living, breathing, thing. It is the community that gives it it's heartbeat and it is the community that will keep it alive. Please email the gm's with your questions and concerns and do not give up if they are slow to answer, for they usually are.
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Another JOZI CHAT is in order, and hopefully soon. We are losing valuable players because of sheer disgust of how things are transpiring lately. Game release notes are too far spaced out and leaves us with doubt as to whether the gm's are keeping up with the majority of players concerns. I hope they see that we feel that we have absent GMs. Jonnie Gil and whoever else was brought in to help give answers to player problems with game issues, WHERE ARE YOU? Where is this assistance that we were told was going to be afforded? It is times like these that we all need you the most, yet we can't find any of you. This is what is driving out the player base, young and old. If established veterans of the game are struggling, how can we offer advice with a straight face to those that are not so veteran on issues we used to have a firm grasp of? We have lost all credibility if we cannot tend our own problems. We will look like soapbox hypocrites.
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Give us a hand and some understanding. We have all earned it by sticking by you and being there for these newer players that you are determined to attract and keep around. We all want to help make this game successful. And we openly root for that to happen. Help us, Help you.
T. |
| WildEyes (White Giant) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 04:08 am
I would actually like an opportunity to find out whether some of these resulted from an error in programming or were intentional. |
| Parsifal (Kebir Blue) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 04:34 am
often change results in unintended consequences. my guess is that in trying to change certain aspects of the game, numerous unintended results have occurred. Q,T and others have well documented these changes and hopefully w3 will respond before these changes force us all out of the game. |
| Aleksander (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 05:08 am
I have been playing for several months and I have found the changes to be on such an order that it is impossible to plan.
The GM changed employment numbers around Thanksgiving, leaving my empire with huge employment issues. I have also had to cope with disappearing HLW - no matter how many times I converted 50000 teachers to HLW, I always ended up with 24000 the next month.
I have watched IPO's become nearly impossible. I have tried to cope with the diminishing value of cash - yes diminishing value. Basic Liquidity is an issue. I am finding it harder and harder to fund military spending as profits decline - placing me further and further behind the vets with their huge weapon and ammo stores.
I have watched my CEO plunge in value, assets, and profitability while growing much larger.
If I wanted to play a random game I would Roulette or craps, but I wanted to play a game where insight into the game mechanics and a strategic view could translate into skill. Instead, I find myself frustrated in a game that lacks predictability in the basic rules. |
| Keith Allaire (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 06:07 am
I returned, yes, that's right, returned to SC in March 2008. Shortly thereafter, as I began to expand and took a C3 to invest in, nurture, and develop the beginnings of an empire, I noticed an intriguing problem.
My slave of 10M collected more in income taxes than my main of nearly three times the size. My main had nearly twice the concentration of high tech workers per capita who should've been paid more, because its education system had been built up. Both countries had about the same unemployment rate. And yet the slave was STILL collecting substantially more in income tax.
I mailed W3C to point out the logical inconsistency. Their response was "There is no error, the slave must be more productive."
I pulled the numbers, and pasted them, and reduced them to multiples by worker group "Main has 2.5 as many times employed HTEs as slave" for example, and mailed the evidence to W3C.
Response: "There is no error. There is no bug."
Some months later, I read in the game news that the beginners' income booster is now split off from the income taxes collected line item in the financial statement. FINALLY! That explained the bug I thought I'd found perfectly. It was almost like W3C wanted credit for FINDING the problem in addition to fixing it. That Tom simply was not capable of examining problems that players mailed him about, even when presented with evidence, and actually admitting that a bug existed. The bug continued for several months, all because W3C was unwilling to look into the suspicious employment/tax data that a player provided them.
I URGE W3C to change this attitude, and to be more responsive when players make bug reports. Yes, I am giving W3C the benefit of the doubt here and assuming the trade strats over 300 issue is a bug and not an intentional ceiling. If it is the latter, a LOT of players, I suspect, will leave in disgust. |
| General Dirt (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 07:35 am
I agree with all of the above. My main on LU went from 500-600B mon. consistantly to barley 300B. I have more corps now than I did back then! With all of the changes happening I'd be a fool to buy the "its just a bug" excuse. Bugs happen, but not with every bug leaning to the GM favor.
Its BS. If it doesn't get corrected I can't see 1 good reason to swipe my credit card anymore, ever. I'll simply use my gc stockpile till its gone and then poof....right along with many other players.
Dirt
PS-I'll also quit advertising this site thru my Myspace account. Lets get this game fair again! |
| IndustMech (White Giant) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 08:27 am
If I owned a company that provided a service I would want customers like the above people. People who would let me know if my company was doing something that might cost me their business.
W3C, WE LIKE YOUR PRODUCT.
We understand that change has to happen, but the changes that have been made lately make many of your customers not want to do business with you.
The comments posted above are shared by many. The questions all should be answered.
W3C Please make this right. Please respond. |
| quaxocal (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 09:44 am
Treasurer, could not have said things better myself. I'm still awaiting email replies from W3C regarding the "can't sell product over 300% of market price" problem. They were very prompt with my first 2 emails (2 hours, and a day and a half response times). Its been a week now for my follow up emails and no reply still.
Many veteran players are considering leaving the game. If the stealth changes continue at their current pace, and if economies continue to be ruined at their current pace, soon all that will be left are new players who will immediately quit when they realize they can't ever be successful.
W3C, Jozi, Tom, and whoever else is in charge, I'm urging you, listen to the community. We actually play the game every day, we see the FULL effect of the changes you make. You are destroying the game economically with all of these changes. Soon no one will be able to run a profitable country or enterprise or even corporation. Please, fix the problems which you are creating for us.
Q |
| coolwind (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 05:01 pm
It is a good product, but as I have said before, the management, and customer care leaves a lot to be desired.
I started this game on the 1st October, 4 weeks before Q and I was really impressed and keen to play. I put a lot of effort in with the result that I got to level 5 and 3rd on GR, with good support and help from the likes of T, Cje, EO and others.
My interest is now waining because of the lack of communication and after sales service from the owners of this game. I thought it would be more professionally run than this.
Like Q, T and others I use the info and figures in the game to create wee spread sheets to figure strategy and direction in the game. It's now getting to the point where I can't really be bothered keeping up with all the nonsense anymore, as witnessed by my now static position on GR.
I have 98 GCs left and when they are gone, so will I probably.
I would be quite happy to pay a reasonable fee to play the game, with the opportunity to be free to be as successful as one wants to be without the goal posts being moved all the time, but I am not going to keep extending my membership just to get some GCs, that I now can't get with ever decreasing SC cash.
The one thing I did notice after I entered the game was that it had, and needs, a highly intelligent player base.
The marketing efforts of the owners should take cogniscance of that intellect and tailor the game accordingly, because whether they like it or not unsuccessful players who lack the knack will not keep paying to play it.
Together with providing successful players with GC awards, the GMs must provide the code for player(customer) satisfaction.
Any successful business must embrace that.
At 60 years of age I must be one of the oldest players on here, enjoying pitting my real time business acumen against the game.
I also enjoy the banter amongst the obviously younger crowd and the many diverse debates on these forums. I don't want to miss that, but I am afraid that the GMs may not be able to sustain that culture. |
| Keith Allaire (Little Upsilon) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 08:32 pm
The 300 cap problem is not limited to high quality products. Consider a missile interceptor corp on LU, where missile ints are well over 2M in shortage...
product Q=182, trade strat=242, production=70, sold same month, base price=18.52M
income= 2,825.18M SC$
should be 3137288000
I calculated that the game capped this corp at a 218 trade strat. More accurately the corp only got paid for a 218 trade strat when set to 242, reduce 10. Reduction is nonfactor as the product sold the same month. Why? It makes aggressive pricing strategies worthless. And LU is in need of aggressive pricing strategies for ammo corps right now. It makes building weapons corps completely pointless over products that are in demand in both times of war and peace. |
| cje (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 09:30 pm
I have worked in IT for over 20 years and am well aware that application tweaks can lead to unforseen issues. When this occurs the service provider is duty bound to either repudiate such claims (providing evidence) or take remedial action in a timely fashion.
The thing that I find really strange in this scenario is the deafening silence from the GM gods. In my rl this would have now have led to financial penalties being paid to the customers and impending lawsuites not to mention termination of contracts (oh I forgot this may be about to happen with some players stating they will leave SC)
GM gods - enough time has elapsed since this issue was first raised. A response is required asap |
| Slare (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 09:45 pm
I do think communication is the key here. Fixing the problems or tweaking how the game plays in what is probably a very complex codebase can take time to get right, and I think we all understand that.
But you have to tell us what's up. If the game is playing as you intended, let us know that. If its broken and needs fixing, let us know that too.
Leaving the customer in limbo is frankly the worst possible thing you can do. |
| coolwind (Golden Rainbow) | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 11:12 pm
CJ, Slare,........that's the whole point, and I cannot comprehend their thinking on this.
If I treated my clients like this I'd be bust! |
| Brian K (White Giant) | Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 12:25 am
The fact is this game is run by the most incomptent morons I have ever seen in my life. |
| Treasurer (White Giant) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 06:14 am
I don't even know if they care anymore. |
| quaxocal (Golden Rainbow) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 06:49 am
I would say judging by their repeated silence, as long as people continue to pay them to play, they don't care. Its all about the $. |
| coolwind (Golden Rainbow) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 02:12 pm
They certainly do not appear to have much business acumen. |
| The Crafty Cockney (Kebir Blue) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 04:00 pm
Ahhh, you love it and you know you do. Thats why you're still here.  |
| Treasurer (White Giant) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 04:19 pm
Well when they notice that more and more Extensions are not being purchased for CEO accounts, maybe they will wake up because they notice that the players have caught on that CEO's are now a worthless aspect of the game since you cannot make a profit with them.
Once the CEOs go or dry up, COUNTRIES that have CEO based economies will dry up as well. Then what are Tom and Jozi going to do?
(I'll tell ya..)
1. Advertise for some more business on outside sites
2. Ignore emails
3. Add more videos
4. Add trains (They are hoping to get Manny back)
5. Give more feebies to n00bs.
6. Increase membership cost (gotta keep up their profits)
7. Ignore some more emails.
8. Add some more maps.
9. Make some stupid additions to the war engine (ones that will be full of bugs)
10. They will tell Laguna to tell us all to quit whining. |
| John R | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 04:26 pm
Quit whining. |
| WildEyes (Kebir Blue) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 04:26 pm
WildEyes
to Gamemaster
show details Jan 24 (6 days ago)
Reply
Dear W3C,
Along with other players, I have noticed the amount of cash we are allowed to transfer to corporations has been reduced twice recently. First to 60B, now to 50B maximum. While this is understandable an in line with the recent policy to reduce the levels of cash in game, it has undercut another aspect: the share market.
For example, I have electric corporations in "The Lightning in Her Eyes" on LU which are above 300B in value, and consistently make profit over 3B per month thanks to some aggressive management; however, I am not allowed to IPO these because the corporation assets are listed as too low. This problem arose due solely to the recent cash changes.
I request the parameters for IPOing to be changed (and listed on the news so other players won't need to email you) in order to be appropriate in the new/emerging lower-cash game environment. If such a change is already on the docket or the 'to-do' list, I will kindly assuage the uppity townsfolk in Forum-ville for you.
Regards,
WildEyes
Reply
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Forward
Gamemaster
to me
show details 3:35 AM (6 hours ago)
Reply
Hi,
You have a good point here.
In general we are indeed reducing thresholds because the amounts and numbers are declining.
We will reduce the threshold for IPO too.
An IPO should be possible if the corporation shows high profitability, high market value, no loans and some cash.
I will check the conditions and make adjustments.
The gamemaster
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Now, be assuaged uppity residents of Forum-ville!
At least for the IPOs |
| Keith Allaire (Little Upsilon) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 05:35 pm
Now, how he willfully ignores the e-mails about him making trade strategies worthless... |
| Johanas Bilderburg (Little Upsilon) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 08:02 pm
As in life and real business...
Adaptation to change is essential to survival. |
| quaxocal (Golden Rainbow) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 09:10 pm
Well since Wildeyes got a response, maybe she should be the one to email about that? I'm having no luck. |
| FarmerBob (Little Upsilon) | Friday, January 30, 2009 - 09:52 pm
Curiously, shares are not trading on the 1-7, and 24-end of each month. I have 14 IPO's sitting that will not process? |
| Karff (Little Upsilon) | Saturday, January 31, 2009 - 07:08 pm
The update on December 23rd:
Before, share trading was running each hour with many exceptions. If there was a simulation run at the same time, it was skipped and if there was very heavy processing that caused some database locking it was skipped even more.
As a result, share trading was running only about 50% of the time. We are now running the share trading each hour. If a simulation process is due to run, we make sure that a share trading run is started and completed just before it starts and another just after it is finished.
The change resulted in more frequent share trading during all hours, day and night.
Perhaps the 24 of month - 7 of next month is the deadtime in between share runs? So IPOs wouldn't go through until the next one starts |
